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Sergey Pavlovich, a former carder who spent 10 years in prison for cybercrimes, will tell you about his path to success from prison to a successful Internet business in the new Light Apps Podcast. In the podcast, we will consider many interesting topics, from affiliate marketing and SEO promotion to making money on YouTube and creating a personal brand. Sergey will share his experience in creating a cashback service, his own VPN, traffic arbitrage, promoting YouTube channels, talk about the difficulties and disadvantages of working with gray schemes on the darknet, and also give advice on how to make money on the Internet without investment. How and how much you can earn on traffic arbitrage and how arbitrage can be associated with carding. He will also talk about his startups in the field of IT and e-commerce, and share schemes for earning and monetizing YouTube channels. We will also cover important aspects of cybersecurity, such as protection against ransomware and phishing sites, as well as methods for preventing theft of bank data and computer crimes, and how not to fall for a scam yourself. We will discuss how Internet scammers make money through calls and what kind of trash call centers have become. Sergey will talk about personal branding and ways to monetize an audience, including selling merch, creating side businesses, etc. We will discuss the success stories of other famous bloggers, such as MrBeast and Dan Bilzerian, changes in monetization income for Ksenia Sobchak, Pivovarov and Varlamov. A former hacker will talk about how he himself achieved success on YouTube with the People PRO channel. Don't miss this exciting interview with Sergey Pavlovich, which will change your view of making money on the Internet, cybersecurity and many other topics, including VPN, ransomware, as well as organic applications, ASO promotion and much more!
Contents:
Intro
Sergey:
What are we going to talk about today? Well, about money.
Speaker 1:
Where should we drain the embezzled money?
Sergey:
I think I'm number one at this.
Speaker 2:
Cars, vans, girls, drugs. You were corrupted by money, and you kind of paid for it.
Sergey:
Prison is an expensive business. Three phones for everyone, there's a back door. A kind of a pit house, like in this zone.
Speaker 2:
You can here, here and there, study, and you'll have millions.
Speaker 1:
I think they offered a billion dollars for the channel.
Sergey:
I'm not a blogger, I'm an entrepreneur first and foremost.
Speaker 1:
Maybe Interpol will come there and just rake everyone in.
Sergey:
About 120 million dollars a year in liabilities. I come, and they tell me - zero.
Sergey Pavlovich – podcast guest
Speaker 1:
Hello, guys. Another evening with us on the Light Apps Podcast channel. Today we have a really cool guest – Sergey Pavlovich. He is one of the top YouTubers in the CIS. He wrote a book that needs no introduction and served 10 years in prison specifically for you. For you.
Sergey:
For you, for us and for the special forces.
Speaker 1:
That’s why, guys, you need to listen to this topic very, very carefully.
We definitely won’t take people like that into reconnaissance.
Speaker 2:
Yes, guys, hello everyone, it’s hard to interrupt such an intro, so I’ll just say it briefly, we’ll try to bring up some interesting topics. I think Sergey and I will definitely have something to talk about. That is, everything you like. The Internet, money, something gray. In general, let’s talk about Sergey.
Sergey:
Sex, drugs, rock and roll, if we’re talking about me specifically. Glad to see everyone on the new channel, yes, I like coming to new channels. And with my presentation, quite a few specialists, like you, have become bloggers. Glad to meet you here, subscribe. Saw me, subscribed. In principle, you should already have it as a reflex. And what are we going to talk about today? Well, about money, right? Well, let's talk about money.
"Where to drain the stolen money?"
Speaker 1:
We have a lot of Internet audiences, so to speak, zarabitchani, people who want to make money on the Internet, make money on mobile applications, on traffic arbitrage, and so on. And they are very interested in the question of where to drain the embezzled money?
Sergey:
They want to earn money, and preferably earn a lot. Well, where to drain the stolen money, it would be better to ask Slobozhenko. I think. I'm kidding, I have a good attitude towards Sasha, but I once talked to my friend and said, listen, is Slobozhenko a normal arbitrator? He says, I don't know what kind of arbitrator he is, but he's definitely a good carder. That's the joke Sasha has on the Internet. So, well, about arbitration, if so.
About Arbitration
Sergey:
Personally, I don't really like arbitration, because I don't like routine things. Even in a day, I have a problem, we have 30 projects, even more, 30 of which have not yet been launched. In short, there are a lot of projects, but I'm not patient, I can't do one all day. I need to do something else every hour or two. That is, I swim a day, giving instructions on about four projects. And all this routine activity, I would definitely not be able to work as a Jeweler. And as an arbitrator, too.
Favorite sources of traffic
Sergey:
Because you need creativity, flight, doing repetitive things, but somehow it’s not for me at all. But with all this, I’m arbitraging now, but I like it when traffic is free. Therefore, my two favorite sources of traffic, naturally, are YouTube. I have my own channel “People of Prona” 830 thousand, a number of others, a network of entire channels.
And SEO, naturally, because SEO, there are not such complicated rules, yes, that is, in fact, SEO now comes down to what on the Internet? It comes down to the technicality of the site, you should have normal epogenations, canonical, hreflang and everything else, if you have a multilingual site, you should have bread circles and so on. That is, just basic rules, some kind of checklist that any SEO specialist can, therefore, master very quickly.
Plus usability. As a business owner, I put myself in my clients' shoes and understand that this button is stupid, I wouldn't click it here, it's inconvenient. Especially now. I didn't have this understanding before, but now, when projects come one after another, it's common sense. And that's why when Dima, Vitalik and I were talking on my channel, Dima said something absolutely wonderful, that you should work for hire. But I have something to add to that.
That is, work for hire in the area that is potentially interesting to you, that you are good at, that your soul lies in. You will gain experience, you will not make mistakes that you could make with your own money. You will not make them anymore, because you will be working in a corporation. And then you always gain experience, and leave there. That's why I prefer YouTube and SEO from arbitration. SEO, when you have already debugged and so on, it comes down to what? To writing articles, essentially, expanding the semantic base, yes, and a very fast site.
Because Mobile First now, because even when we go to Google PageSpeed, we see that they have already moved the mobile version to the first place, and a very fast site, and that's it. Well, naturally, we have a tool, it's all who... arbitrageurs, I don't know if they use it or not, but SEOs, Ahrefs is the same. Ahrefs is all the rage, basically. You see the semantic base of competitors and so on, you see the approximate traffic for each keyword.
And it's interesting, that is, it's clear that in trust, for example, I have coupon sites, yes. It's clear that in the top there are trusted sites, which have 10-15 years of dominance there. I'm interested in navareg. I tried to muddle SEO there, screw the system, buy drops there, old dominance there, but it all doesn't work. That is, you take navareg and just make a normal site. Here, and SEO traffic, it is the most targeted, it is valued everywhere, both in your field and in any of ours.
Speaker 2:
Well, look, as you said about your YouTube channel, yes, it is a good channel, I watched it a long time ago, I remember, I was even a kid, I tried something... Kid not in terms of age, but in terms of intelligence, you know, I wanted to learn some new information. I watched it, super interesting content, you have a very unusual story from the beginning, how you go and move on.
About love for SEO and organic traffic
Speaker 2:
About SEO, I would say, you say you like SEO, not Arbitrash, but the SEO part, I like it too.
For example, we have ASO, and this is one of my favorite niches. That is, if we take there, you buy traffic, it's cool, but ASO is just like a money button.
Sergey:
For me, it's like meditation. That is, I can write articles for websites, menu items, change, arrange, translate a website. Well, I just like tinkering with it. Some people like cars, yes, I like tinkering with websites.
"Is there money on the Internet?"
Speaker 2:
And if we take money specifically, that is, let's ask a simple question. Is there money on the Internet?
Sergey:
Yes, of course, of course, huge.
Speaker 2:
Everyone just knows most about arbitration, that is, if we take arbitration. Can we consider something other than arbitration, do you have a lot of experience?
Sergey:
Development, development, that is, well, the agency model, yes, when you develop Aprils or custom websites for someone, as you said in our last issue, media buying, I don't like it at all, it's not that profitable. You depend on clients, a lot of approvals, running after them, calling them. You need to have good salespeople, you need to train salespeople, especially, probably, an important part of the job, and that's it. But this is work with a large number of clients.
Development, here is an example from yours, from the mobile environment, just Gursky, I think, Yuri, from Belarus, this is the application "Masks on the light of God" Masquerade. Masquerade, yes. Then he has some other one now on yoga or mental health, there is something cool, some, well, startups that are sold for hundreds of millions of dollars. Here, a regular application, yes. Well, I have not yet managed to create such, but unfortunately, I have not paid attention to the mobile niche for a long time.
Basically, all my projects that bring me money or that I develop, they are primarily, well, web. That is, it has never happened that we initially develop only an application right away. I always have a web and some application for it.
Speaker 1:
Well, like with the VPN that you have, which is this one. But, as far as I understand, you are going to make a mobile version. That's it.
Speaker 2:
And regarding Gursky, as you said, the masquerade, there is actually a cool story there, how it all works. It's simple, look, from the outside it seems like the guys made a product, sold it successfully, right? But in fact, there is a whole business model there. That is, there are applications, like we do. These are products that we buy herbs there, or we move organics, a different story. And this is a slightly different niche of products. So, what is the essence there? There are some products that are inflated by hype.
That is, when they reach a certain peak, you need to sell them in time.
Sergey:
But they sold it to a strategist, they sold it to Facebook.
Speaker 2:
And everything is fine.
Sergey:
And, you know, even Facebook is not interested in this application. They took the technology.
Speaker 2:
For all these products, your key must be technology. Because you need to sell it, otherwise what, Dima?
Speaker 1:
Otherwise, you'll go broke.
Speaker 2:
Yes, that's how it works. If they hadn't managed to sell, the technology would have fallen, and operationally they wouldn't have been invented.
Sergey:
Well, it's definitely a skill, a hunch, probably. That is, it is unknown whether Gursky's action is based on analysis, yes, or on hunch. Both have an equal right to exist, and many move by hunch. For example, I move only by hunch, I'm shitty with mathematics, a true pure humanities scholar, so only by hunch.
Niches for earning money on the Internet
Sergey:
But if we go back to niches, to niches of earning money on the Internet, arbitration is also clear, applications are also clear, you can make ones like the guys do, they are ordered to download just money, I don’t like it, I like creativity more, That is, therefore, development, application of some startups. And in applications there is a lot of money in some in general, but I also like the e-commerce sphere. That is, since I also come from arbitration, that is, I have cashback, now I have coupons.
Speaker 1:
And vodka?
Sergey:
And vodka, and this is a small circulation, this is a limited edition, it’s like closing the gestalt, I really don’t like unfinished business. And I succeed, I closed this case with imprisonment, after 13 years I finished it, but there was a project started, but it needs to be finished. Sometimes it’s worth quitting, but I can’t do that yet, they are like my children, I like to raise them a little. And in e-commerce, for example, there is a lot of money.
Earnings on coupon sites
Sergey:
For example, there is a Western coupon site RetailMinute, it was recently sold for a half yard, well, not recently, about 5 years ago, but it downloads approximately just a site on the Internet, a site on the Internet, which downloads approximately 150 million dollars in profit per year on coupons. There are other models. I also found an interesting point with coupon sites. Each major American media outlet, be it Forbes, CNN and so on, they have a coupon site.
It often hangs on a subdomain, for example, coupons.forbes.com or coupons.cnn.com. And I noticed in my e-commerce research, searches, that 100% of them are given a coupon fit by one supplier, because Forbes has it, which means it is everywhere, and vice versa. And I still could not get to the bottom of who gives it to them, I kind of look for that cell, but I just could not.
And then I accidentally look at the Forbes website, in the header there are coupons provided to us by some company, well, this is a policy of openness, all things are according to the law, but they removed it after two months, but I was lucky, I just managed to suck in who it was, I went to their website, I see that some kind of contour is there, and I won’t just say the name, look for it yourself, Canadian, and what did they do, they made a coupon site that is not the coolest, not at all with the largest number of coupons, they just did it a long time ago, five years ago, and they shoved in their own, finished coupon site,
they stuck a large source of traffic, and I looked at this model, and I collected a huge pack of coupons for my other business, I just have collected, well, probably more than anyone else in the world, now we'll delete duplicates, well, 1150-200 active coupons will be there and I thought, well, why shouldn't I repeat this model, but they didn't cover, for example, segments, yes, they didn't cover large media, but they didn't even cover in America, there are some giant forums, they didn't cover, that is, Brazilian media in Brazil. They didn't cover, for example, Poland, that is, there are plenty of markets to come to, so I made a first-class coupon site specifically for interlinking by sections, by convenience, by everything, having looked at that, well, of course, I can't afford that. And this office, yes, at least, it earns 20 million a year. I don't know in what proportion they saw with the traffic source, with Forbes, for example, but they claim that they have about 20 million dollars a year in passive income.
Once they made, in fact, a business, yes. And I like such businesses, and I did, since I myself am from the blogging environment, I made a dome, which I will now give on a turnkey basis, I don't know, there, to the media and bloggers in particular, because the blogging niche is not closed, especially now. You are drowning, oh, how can we earn money, we are not agents.
Income from the People PRO channel
Sergey:
Well, I have 1.1 million in profit last year from the channel, that is, well, how, to earn your products, of course, first of all.
In America, how do bloggers earn money? They don't wait. We have integration in the Russian-speaking environment. You wait for an advertiser to come, yes, and there he is a brand, he earns a lot on merch and earns money by creating some of his own products, someone comes to them in partnership, so I can give a coupon tomorrow in Orla, I can develop, I go in this direction to make some product and give it out en masse, or I also collected for my own internal needs, I needed to make referral links to products for our one application, and it turned out as if by accident that I collected the largest number of stores in the world under my hood.
Service for bloggers
Sergey:
And now I have the largest CPA network, and we made a simple interface, it will probably work already, when the release comes out. It already works, just list the interface.
In essence, what are you doing? You are a blogger. You are a blogger, but you sell your services, let's say. And he is a blogger, he is young, he sells no services, no goods, nothing. But he talks well, I don’t know, about… He is a carpenter, planes, hammers, stall-keeper, jack of all trades. And we did… You have nothing to sell of your own, let’s say, for now, but we did it so that you can make a revka in one place for 80 thousand shops.
You go to Walmart, take the hammer you talk about in every video, or a plane, or a chainsaw, and make a referral link. And it's convenient. Why? Why do I make a large structure? Here's the meta, if my memory serves me right, there are 5 thousand shops at CJ, there at Rakuten Advertising, well, they have 3-5 thousand shops. I collected 80, just if a blogger inserted it to us, and there, well, we can't make a referral link, most likely, this means that the store simply does not have a referral program.
And you don't have to go all over the Internet looking for where to make a referral link to it. Everything is in one place. And at the intersection of e-commerce, at the intersection of e-commerce and blogging, I want to spend the next 5 years or so, because both areas are actively developing, and there is money everywhere.
Earnings on a personal brand, MrBeast
Speaker 1:
Well, you're a hottie in this regard, because in fact, in the CIS space, many don't buy out, American dudes like Dan Bilzerian and so on, they earn billions of dollars purely around the product thanks to their name. They release various CBD, clothes and so on. Conventionally, the most popular is Mr. Bit, some chocolates, I watched him, T-shirts.
He was offered a billion dollars for channels, it's not because of the channel, but because it's all together, there, the channel grid, plus e-com, plus the business approach, that is, everything.
Sergey:
Amazon has now paid him a hundred million to film a show for them. Well, that is, in fact, he films for himself, but broadcasts not on his YouTube, but on Amazon Prime.
Speaker 2:
Well, there was a funny story with him, when this billion, what you're talking about, was offered to him, he says, I sat for a while, thought, I would become the youngest billionaire, there, only Kylie Jenner was younger. He says, and then, he says, he figured, why should I take and promote someone else's product, if I have many more views there than any Super Bowl in America. And he says, it's easier for me to make any product of my own there, conditionally. I can make my lemonade, I can make my chips, I can make my courses, as you say, sell a hammer, conditionally.
And that's it, I will earn more with the Mr. Beast brand than I will sell a channel to someone.
Sergey:
There is a problem with this, especially in the CIS, a problem of some kind of lack of centralized platforms where you can make your merch, soda, and so on. And I read Morenes, Arkady Morenes is like that, well, I think that he does the most for the venture market. I read from him, well, we made merch and let's say there is an office, I can link directly to my channel, well, and you will also be able to link over time, when you have more than a thousand subscribers, I think, your own shop, but you need to do it somewhere in some shop.
And so, for example, in the States there is a company, it used to be called T-Spring, and now it is simply called Spring. You can order merch there without leaving your home. That is, you have a designer, the assortment is huge now, when I ordered, there was maybe position 15, now, maybe, there are 200. From a condom to a cartridge, a mug, there, a T-shirt, whatever you want, a cap, a towel. It’s
shitty to put on a towel. And you just upload your logo, you chose, let’s say, a towel, what colors you want. You chose 3-4 colors, took the logo, stretched it, a very convenient designer, that’s it, cool, the future belongs to such products.
Designer for merch
Sergey:
There are none like that in the CIS, there were maybe only two companies, and I read in Morenes that there are some guys who, I understand, this market, they really united, I don’t remember, some British site, and I wouldn’t say if I knew, well, if I remembered.
I’m keeping it for myself. They have a lousy designer, but what did they do? This is generally an office, it’s not a manufacturer, it’s just like Dodo Pizza.
Speaker 1:
Just a marketplace.
Sergey:
Yes, they simply brought an IT component to a disparate business. And they essentially united everyone who prints business cards, watches, all sorts of emblems on watches, in short, mugs and everything else, T-shirts, from any part of the world. They have a shitty designer, unsuccessful so far. But I understand that we will connect them to our blogger app, ecosystem. This is the application you were talking about, right?
Speaker?:
Yes.
Sergey:
Mesh app. Mesh app. Now next year, well, in April there will be an ICO. What did we do? I am an investor in this project, actually. Well, it so happened that I am a player-coach there. A man came. By the way, there were a lot of cool people from Clubhouse. That is, we got to know a lot of people. The director that I told you about backstage, he is American, he wrote to me from there. Well, he saw me there.
And in general, it is very cool. A lot of entrepreneurs. Well, because the most active ones are there.
Speaker 2:
Clubhouse.
Functionality of the service for bloggers
Sergey:
They come out just during the pandemic. And a man came and said that we need to make an app. I will make an app for every blogger there and back. For every blogger. One is a food blogger, the second is beauty, the third is like you, tech, the fourth is, there, lifestyle. And you will simply get tired of supporting 100-200-300. Firstly, customize for every need, secondly, maintain them 200-300-500 – it’s just hell.
And I say, let's make one. Well, we do, we do it for a long time for a number of reasons. We had no experience in applications at all, we made it for three years. You will probably laugh now, being on the channel about the application, but we made it for three years. And we have only made an Android version so far, but now the backsite is normal, the backend. And now we will make, of course, an iPhone version as well. We simply combined all the needs of a blogger and his audience into one application.
Patreon with its paid subscriptions. We made a one-time donation, like a super thank you on YouTube under any type of content. Stories, like on Instagram, but again you can sell your products with your markets. Stories, live broadcasts with the possibility of sale. They even did it like, I don’t know, mamba, they used it once for those familiar with the site, but in general it was a cool thing, you write a figurative comment of some kind, and it hangs there, the king of the mountain was called, until no one, let’s say you put 10 dollars, until no one puts 11, it hangs, and we did it on our own, that is, please, under any post I can go to your profile, under your video or post write a comment, pin it for 50 dollars and wait, maybe it will hang there for a year, in general, it’s cool, you can advertise there, well, of course, if you are some guy, for advertising, that the moderator will take it down, this will be agreed upon, but in general.
Yes, we did things like this, posts like on Instagram, in short, videos, for example, I upload to the YouTube channel, it immediately shows up on the counter, the same with podcasts, events, you can create a concert right away, sell tickets, in short, courses and a market, I would like to dwell on the market in more detail. In the market, physical goods, like I have, for example, physical goods, electronic goods, that is, sell your own soundtracks, please, stripe and crypto are connected, and e-books, for example.
But there is also such a startup, well, like a startup, an existing business, a billion valuation, cameo, for example. If you don’t know what cameo is, it’s just an app where you can order congratulations on video from Jackie Chan, from Obama, from anyone you want, in short. And all this, like all the functions that I’m talking about, they, ah, and here we also sell advertising, well, and blockchain for the transparency of transactions, for blogger investments.
And it seems like everything that I listed to you, it all exists, yes, but it exists in 15 apps. Okay, in 10 apps, but why do I need 10 apps if I want to get everything from a blogger in one place. By the way, this is a big problem for young bloggers. Why did we earn a lot, I probably earned even more this year, because we have a lot of everything, there are channels, publics, a website, there is a website with referral links, where some proven services are recommended by themselves, VPN, there, to proxies and, I don’t know, to stores figuratively, Lamoda and Booking, that’s it.
We just have too much of everything. I counted, we have 15 units with which we pump money to YouTube, that is, YouTube and 14 units.
Income from the People PRO channel
Speaker 1:
By the way, what is the income structure on the channel, that is, from what is it more, from what, well, can you give figures, can you without, or at least reduce it in order?
Sergey:
Before the war it was about 8 thousand dollars with monetization, now it is, well, 800 dollars, in short, it has dropped 10 times. Integrations, a lot of integration and advertising, advertising of their products more. By the way, I am lucky with us, we have such cool advertisers who allow, well, who pay us for advertising, but they also allow us to throw in a roar. Well, it is like, there, on beer, on cognac, well, on caviar, there, well, not the most direct.
Well, 100 thousand, I don’t know, rubles, there, in three months, there, they accumulate, well, and okay, as it were. That is, they already pay another 100 thousand for, that’s it. And most of all, probably, right now, advertising of products, both their own, here are cashbacks, coupons and so on, VPN, and so on, and others. We have some kind of affiliate program, no one else has, and again, I don’t like to work myself, that is, well, it’s not that I don’t like, I like to work, and there’s a lot of work.
I mean, figuratively dividing this affiliate program into 5-10 bloggers, I just say, pour through me, and your income will still be 2 times more than you will pour standardly. And they agree, the guys pour, and that’s it, we just saw off the profit with them 50-50, and it’s profitable for them, and it’s profitable for me too. And with an eye, we get from 70 to 100 per month, now there’s a slight drawdown.
Telegram bot with night butterflies
Sergey:
Then there’s another cool affiliate program, there are also guys who started a business.
The guys did it simply, threw whores into the Telegram bot. That's it, you can call her, meet her there. And the Telegram bot just takes money from you and gives you access to the profiles.
Speaker 1:
Like a marketplace.
Sergey:
Well, that's it, yeah. But nevertheless, the lifetime revka is 50%. You know, and who has their own traffic channels in Telegram and so on, that is, a subscription there costs about 100 dollars a month. That is, it's even cooler than the app.
Speaker 1:
Just to open contacts.
Sergey:
Yes.
How to find an idea for making money
Speaker 2:
You're doing it, you've built the entire current income structure, so to speak, white. Around yourself. Yourself and traffic, and brand. That is, what you were talking about at the beginning. That is, it turns out that you have your brand, you have your traffic, you've been growing it for a long time, now you're trying to monetize it, and you're monetizing it organically, and not in a brutal way. That is, you have different directions that fit organically into working with you. For example, the pinnacle of all this is an application for bloggers.
That is, on a turnkey basis, you can do everything you want there. A must-have application for every blogger, in fact.
Sergey:
Yes, well, I think that it is probably just a lot of projects, well, you see, it is difficult for a founder to single out some of his projects. I like cashback, for example, this is my first major project, and I like this, it is, the potential is most of all in this blogging application. And most of the functions in it are exactly what I like, they were born from my real needs. So I need a hall, yes, I have held many meetings with subscribers, and sooner or later you will hold them with subscribers and colleagues.
And there is a problem. For example, tomorrow I am flying to Vilnius. I do not mind meeting with them. But I need to announce it somewhere widely, as widely as possible, so that as many Lithuanians as possible see it. Then find out how many of you will come. And, as a rule, I exaggerate myself by 4 times. I am already saying this from experience, I write in Telegram, only those who will definitely come vote. Because the hall and the money depend on it.
And still it needs to be divided by 4. And then it still doesn't come and then the most difficult thing is to find a hall and where should I look I don't know Lithuanian I have limited time and that's it and so we do everything through the app that is I sold tickets through announced events in the app sold tickets there is also a ticket scanner for face control well how do you like the URL just on the web the scanner will open for him and that's it and moreover all who bought tickets they immediately get into the general chat someone will go together to get to know someone and in this chat after a meeting or a concert, if there is a music star, chip in photos as material, and that's it. And when, for example, tickets were sold to me, the sale is already closed, the app tells me, do you have a hall in Vilnius for 27 people, or do you need to find? I say, you need to find. And then the application managers, they just throw off 2-3 options, they take from my money, that's it. And you also told there, like your VPN, yes, when you lived in China, that it was born from your personal needs.
And many of my products are born from my needs. And I use all my projects, be it cashback, coupon codes, and so on, every day myself, well, not every day, weekly, but I use them myself.
Speaker 1:
So we can say that you, a, built a personal brand, then, b, make products and thanks to your personal brand you recommend them to people who are subscribed to you, who follow you, they are interested in your life, you recommend products that you use yourself, and on this, in general, you earn, as you said, a million one hundred a year in the area of your channel.
Sergey Pavlovich's total income
Sergey:
Well, no, it's more, we earned a million one hundred purely on advertising, on interviews, on everything, and in total, if you count, last year it was probably 2 million.
Speaker 1:
Two, probably. Well, it turns out to be two million, but this, according to your estimates, is the largest income among CIS YouTubers around this? So, can we say that you are the most enterprising YouTuber?
Sergey:
I don't think so. Why? Because there are very large channels, Varlamov, Sobchak, for whom one advertisement costs, I don't know, 5 thousand dollars, and for them 35, you know, and they insert two or three advertisements. And now, to be honest, it's funny to me to hear, yes, how Varlamov cries that there is no money, PR and so on.
Well, with such prices for advertising, you should save up a safety cushion for 10 years in advance, why the hell are you standing there now?
The highest level of earnings from Varlamov
Speaker 2:
There is a very funny thing, I don't know if you have seen it or not. He flew to different countries, like China, Japan and so on. And it turns out that when he flew to these countries, he compiled a guide to these countries. And at first he asked for a donation, because they did not have enough money for tickets to these countries. Then they sent him a donation, and he flew to these countries, made a guide, and then he published this guide and said, guys, you can get access to it for money, I traveled around the countries especially for you for your money and made a guide, that you fly to the countries.
Sergey:
No, well, Varlamov is a Jew, what are you saying.
Speaker 2:
Well, this is just the highest level of skill.
"I am No. 1 in this"
Sergey:
Yes, but I can't bring myself to ask for this handout there, that's it, but you see, you say, I built a personal brand, I didn't build it, I don't know how to use it. The thing is that in the same Thailand, yes, in many places, yes, you have an Instagram, let's say, from 40 thousand, you can fly in many hotels for free, they upgrade you almost to first class, I don't know how to use it, I don't know how to ask, you have to write it, introduce yourself, say who you are and so on.
Speaker 1:
You need to have a manager for that. Well, how can I say, he doesn't know how. A person who earns 2 million a year around that probably knows how.
Speaker 2:
I agree, but you also had an initially not entirely correct comparison. You say Varlamov, Sobchak. I would compare more, if we take people who have, say, the same number of subscribers... LTV subscriber, yes, that's how we'll take it. The same number of subscribers and that's the monetization of your audience, your brand, you.
On the desire to develop
Sergey:
Well, I think I'm number one in this, I think, yes, with that number of subscribers. You know, there's another explanation for this, because we communicate with a lot of bloggers, I made someone a blogger myself just with my colleagues, yes, and I don't like two things.
So I went in, I was in one blogger chat, there were 50-60 bloggers with half a million channels, and I flew in on my usual wave, oh, what, yes, you are this, I know you, let's do this, let's mess around with these, let's do this with these, then I write, I have 100 thousand dollars extra, I need to advertise, because I don't remember what VPN or cashback is, what is VPN, I think, and I say, oh, she has VPN, this and that. Or the second example, we tell the guy, and we have a lot of advertisers, but we have certain formats bought out for years in advance, sweaters, for example, with a brand are bought out, I fly into another channel, well, to another channel owner, I say, take this exchanger there, a proven exchanger, we will speed up right away, well, so that we don’t fuck up there, he threw in, yes, we will speed up, I say, check for years, type in how much your advertising costs, he says 5, and what is there to advertise, I say, well, this is crypto, oh, no, crypto 10, go to hell with you, and most of the bloggers, even there are 3-5 times bigger than me, they have occupied a comfortable niche for themselves with earnings of 3-5 thousand dollars a month, yes, they don’t need anything else.
Speaker 1:
No, well, how, they advertise, there are different rates and so on, well, Instagram, at least bloggers, I don’t know about YouTubers there.
Sergey:
Well, YouTube less often, of course, but I mean, they are in their comfort zone, you know, and even if you offer him, dude, you can earn a million there, just do what we do, he will say, no, why the fuck, I say, take 100 thousand, you just do advertising, you are like my proven product, I am in your community, I am responsible for it, this is for me, no way, and laziness, laziness, comfort zone and that’s it. And this, probably, it seems to me, is the main problem, but I can’t, because I still have a fidget in my ass.
And I’m still not a blogger, I am an entrepreneur first and foremost, you know, I think about how to make money.
Speaker 1:
I understand.
"Is carding alive!?"
Speaker 2:
If we take the topic of money, as we started, we discussed different topics in our previous podcasts, so what is your message here now? Grow, as you, as Dima said, a brand, then gather an audience, then try to develop products that, oh, you use yourself, that is, it should not be crap. It should be something, if you use it yourself, then a priori it is no longer crap. And with the help of this, monetize and increase your income, that is, monetize your audience and brand.
Okay, that's now, but if we dive a little back into your past. You know, there is an opinion on the Internet that there are still all sorts of gray topics, murky topics on the Internet, how to make money. Young people watch, dream, remember some of those old ones. As a person with experience, what can you say, should they look in this direction or try to keep up with the times, develop? Is this topic dead or not? How does carding even exist?
Sergey:
Carding is alive, of course, and hacking and ransomware are still alive, but I wouldn't advise it, because you need to start from the chance that you'll be jailed or not. Let's say that many computer crimes happen there and remain so forever, because the victims prefer not to report. And there is an opinion that the percentage of solved and generally known computer crimes, I may be wrong, does not exceed 30%.
That is, your chance of going to jail is 30%, but I would evaluate it differently, I would say that your chance of going to jail is 50%, that is, you either go to jail or not, that is, you do not have a firm guarantee that you will be in the 70% of lucky ones, you see, with my luck, I will definitely be in the 30 idiots who will go to jail and for a long time, that's why I would not advise
getting into this, firstly, secondly, computer forensics, so to speak, I talked to different levels, from different, that is, countries and so on, they have learned to deal with this very well, that's the second point. Well, and the third, we all started this in the 90s, we did not have such opportunities. Now I have a guy who is involved in YouTube, he earns a thousand and something dollars at 19, maybe already at 2 thousand, I don't know.
We have a boy from Uzbekistan, an agent, he sells us advertising, helps, we can't cover everything there ourselves. He's basically just our salesman, he's on a percentage, there were months when he earned 5 thousand dollars, and he's still 17, he's going to college at 20, that's it. That is, there's a ton of work on the Internet, freelancing is full of idiots, even if you write text normally, a copywriter, you can easily replace him.
So there's no point in going into crime now.
About carder gatherings
Speaker 2:
Listen, could we have done it earlier, you say earlier, that is, in the 90s, as I understand it, when all this was starting, there were just some legends, they still are. You know, like now about the arbitrageur, these cars, cars, girls, drugs, that's how carders used to live, that is, these were some closed gatherings where guys would come, they all knew each other, they were encrypted, and they just had a ton of money there, everything was rushing. Was it like that or not? Here you are as a witness of those events.
Sergey:
Well, yes, it was. I didn't really participate in any of those big gatherings, but we were constantly, anyway, you're on the Internet there, well, you're surrounded by all sorts of VPNs, well, that wasn't developed back then, in vain, by the way, fewer people would have been in jail, including me, although I would have been in jail anyway, because I'm a moron. We would constantly visit each other in different countries, because that way you're kind of encrypted on the Internet, but you still have a close circle with whom you constantly work.
Well, and there is already a certain trust, because you have been working for years. We went, we know that Vasya lives in Spain, for example, or in Odessa. We got down to it and got ready to go to him. He, as a rule, paid for everything, naturally, without excesses, so that the person would not strain himself and could pay himself, but somehow we had such an order in our community that the host paid, then they would come to me, I would pay for everything.
There were parties, and this is probably the only moment that I miss from the past, namely from my previous work, so to speak.
Speaker 2:
So they were worth it, it turns out, precisely in such a pleasant moment.
Sergey:
Well, you know what else? It's also just nostalgia for youth. The thing is that now, if you compare our parties that were in the early 2000s with the parties that are held by urbitrageurs, casino people and so on now, and even by some bonus hunters, yes, it's incomparable. Our pale shadow was.
Speaker 1:
Well, by the way, this is very funny, because I watch some conferences there, AVA, Sigma and something else, but Interpol can just come there and just rake everyone in as a guarantor, and I'm very interested in why this doesn't happen. Either there's some kind of lull, or society and the world in general have become uninterested in this, so much has all this become the norm, I don't know, what do you think?
Laundering money through crypto
Sergey:
The money is simply not the same. I can say what interests American law enforcement the most, they are interested in Ransomware, that is, who blocks their corporations, extorts money, including hospitals and so on, yes, and this gas pipeline of theirs, this pipeline was blocked, there is the DarkSide group, it was such a loud one, well, and they are most interested in money laundering, that is, money laundering, naturally, all goes through crypto, therefore, cryptocurrencies, exchange owners, mixer owners especially, Someone was jailed there recently, I don’t remember.
Well, Tornado Cash there, yes. In short, they will be jailed and further persecuted. And even, for example, Bitzlata was an office, yes, figuratively speaking, they started as just a bulletin board, like there you sell crypto, you buy, and that’s it. Then they started taking a percentage of it. That is, they just advertise and advertise. You paid a dollar for it, for example. And then they started taking a percentage. And it backfired on them, because they became a party to the deal unwittingly.
You exchanged dirty money with him, with extortion, with drugs. American cops found out about it. And where else did 10% of the deal go? Here. So, they are kind of involuntary, yes, an accomplice to this deal, although they did not know. And, accordingly, they were brought to criminal responsibility. So, with Vlad and my partner, we made a kind of change, meaning a rating, well, monitoring of exchangers, yes.
And we take this into account, we wouldn't know, but American lawyers told us, my Lithuanian, he told us, he said, look, there was such a scheme, and that's why we only take the onus from them. That is, we don't receive, we receive zero impulses, you understand? Dividends, not shares. Yes, in general, yes. And this is an important point, by the way. And so after my prison terms and so on, I prefer to move, well, just purely in white, everything according to the law, to minimize the chance of me being thrown out again.
Consequences of breaking the law before the United States
Speaker 2:
Well, you see, look, it turns out that the main underlying factor is the American government, American citizens, the American security system, let's call it that, and you, as far as I remember, even had a problem that after your prison terms, two prison terms, and you were resolving the issue with America for quite a long time, even after you finished, that is, you got out.
Sergey:
From the fourth to the twenty-third, I spent nineteen years deciding.
Speaker 2:
So you did your time, you answered for all your actions, and then you spent another 20 years trying to prove that you did your time, guys, I'm already white, I've become white.
Sergey:
But America uses the law of the strong, and by doing so, you know, what's important in justice is not to punish a specific person, but to show others an example that, don't do that.
Speaker 1:
Case law.
Sergey:
Yes, because they're not interested in one person, they're interested in, well, case law is almost about that, they're interested in scaring off 100 potential criminals, they could forgive that one. But they use his example to discourage 100. And that's why they show, my example is not the brightest, for example, the director was Charles Polanski, he was arrested in Switzerland 30 years later for some rape
in the 70s in the USA, and they arrest anyone 10-30 years later and demonstratively give some tough terms or not tough ones to someone, but they show that you can't get away from us. That's why the most savvy carders, for example, those who are still hammering something there in some kind of fraudulent ways, they know this and try, well, you don't need to hammer America, you can hammer Europe, there, I don't know, some CIS or other, Nigeria figuratively there, although Nigeria itself can hammer, and there Brazil and something else, but it's better not to touch America, I realized long ago that it's better not to touch America.
Speaker 1:
Well, by the way, arbitrageurs also don't like to pour America for the same reasons, because there may be some tough lands there.
Sergey:
It doesn't forgive at all.
How to drain carved-out funds
Speaker 1:
Yes, it does not forgive, but Europe, Europe forgives everything. They all pour Europe, and there is something else there. Look, it was also interesting to talk to us, since the audience is mainly, who are there, Internet marketers, various mobile app developers, perhaps our Internet mouser friends. And what is the turnover of this kind of money that we are talking about, which is drained through Facebook, Google and so on, advertising networks, because, as far as I know, this is now one of the largest gateways there.
Sergey:
I don’t know, to be honest, I’m far from it, but the first bills can be attributed to this, probably, yes, when you just make an account, link a virtual card to it and then just throw it away. But it’s hard to unscrew the first bills now, it doesn’t work, they have inserted too many technical methods there. There was a funny case. In short, the guy connected, well, he made the first YouTube account, connected a card there, and some bug happened on YouTube.
And he has a channel about games, about tanks or something, in short, some channel, and he managed to write there from Navareg, there were thousands, in short, 160 or whatever dollars. He got 1,500 subscribers on his channel, his ads and videos just ran out, and there was no money there at all, as if that couldn't happen. It happens, but these are bright cases and that's all. Write yourself who is pouring, how much you drain per day from the card.
Speaker 2:
From the original account.
Sergey:
Yes, and the IP there, don't forget to leave your personal one.
Data theft via Wi-Fi
Speaker 2:
By the way, about IP addresses, leave them there and about carding, if you take. Let's take our VPN products there, yes, for example. There are many people there, like, why do you need a VPN there? We've discussed it many times already. But, in principle, carding is also related to it. That is, if, roughly speaking, people are still a little surprised by their idiocy. They go to a cafe, connect to Macs, to public Wi-Fi, chase, the data is not encrypted, but that's half the trouble. That is, before it was over HTTP, but now you can, for example, come, it's still a working topic, it's been there for 20 years. You can come to an establishment, turn it on.
Sergey:
Create an access point, Wi-Fi and sniff all the cards, all the traffic.
Benefits of using a VPN
Speaker 2:
Call McDonald's, they'll hook you up in a shopping center. You'll have absolutely all the data. Cards, banks, cuckoos, access anywhere. Well, that's it, welcome. Then you find, we won't name it, this whole movement still exists. You go, sell it or make it yourself, if you're a fool. And off you go. But the people there, they're greedy. That is, they need to buy our VPN, not our VPN, it doesn't matter, our good one, for $5, for $10 a month, and that's it, connect anywhere.
You connect, your data won't be at the expense of a thousand percent.
Sergey:
But people don't know this first of all, that VPN encrypts traffic, you know? They don't know, and if it's also in some PM with TLS, then it's even better.
Speaker 2:
Yes, it's hard to get there.
Sergey:
And the question is, well, what does VPN give you? Firstly, access to resources blocked in your country, secondly, it encrypts your traffic. And the fact that it encrypts traffic, that I'll connect to some public Wi-Fi, that's half the trouble. But if I'm involved in crime, like I had this in my case personally, that is, the cops established, the Belarusian ones, they established who my operator was, my home Internet provider, Beltelecom, and that's it, they just knew my home address, where I live, they traced it to the apartment, it was a rented apartment, and they installed a sniffer on Beltelecom, I don't remember what that program was called.
And then they simply analyzed all my traffic according to the layout. Either it's mail or correspondence. It turns out that there's a key logger there. That is, all my logins, passwords, etc. Everything is in the open, not encrypted. That is, if I had a VPN at that time, they were just starting out. The fourth, fifth, sixth year. Then it would have gotten to them with a key length of 256 bits.
It's much more difficult. They would have spent 10 years encrypting it. That's why people just don't know.
Speaker 2:
Well, you see, it turns out to be a two-sided model, that is, they don't know RAS, they don't use it there to access TOR, the same. That is, VPN is not a guarantee that you are not being monitored at all. It's just that you create a tunnel, conditionally, you create an extra layer of security for yourself. But in a public access point, we heard you, don't connect without a VPN. It's just crazy. You are the easiest victim, you provide everything yourself. And then there are many layers of security.
Cashing out stolen money
Speaker 2:
Now, if we take karting, for example, then here's the story. They still work, this is a live topic, phishing sites that are substituted. DNS are substituted, you create 10 sites, say, Privatbank, Monobank, they are all substituted. And that's what Dima initially asked about carding, about arbitrage. There are rumors that many of the guys in the market were guilty of this in order to increase their profitability.
And here's the story. Previously, these cards had to be found by people, they physically went somewhere, bought something. With the Internet era, this whole thing has changed a lot. That is, you could previously put cards in Google, Facebook. It was spinning, filming, only.
Sergey:
Well, this is the second wave of carders. We put this in online stores, just in the simplest way.
Speaker 1:
I know many hotels on Booking, entire hotels exist without real clients.
Sergey:
Yes, even virtual hotels.
Speaker 2:
So there is a super strange scheme, an old one, I don't know how viable it is, about mobile applications. There was a popular thing in Asia, they rolled out an application, some kind of, it doesn't matter which one, I don't know, a flashlight, yes, let's take a calculator, they created subscriptions in it. And then there was a pool of cards, and these cards, Apple IDs were created for them, and Apple didn't ask for a code before. And that's it, from these cards a subscription to their own applications or a one-time purchase was issued.
How Sergey was scammed
Sergey:
Two years ago I replaced my Qiwi card, well it doesn't matter, just a bank card, yes, I received it in an envelope, I linked it to Booking, but decided not to buy from it, went to Sochi with it, only I have the envelope, it's always in my pocket, I come to the restaurant to pay, there were 1050 rubles, I come, and they tell me, zero, I think, how so, in short, well it turns out, I still don't know how it went, to whom and where, yes, I think that Qiwi themselves sinned somewhere, that's because I didn't even pay with it in Booking, I linked it.
But they entered it into games in Google Play Market. And they also entered it, I have 46 thousand rubles, but there were a lot of transactions. About 100 transactions, probably 46 thousand rubles there. And they entered two more times a thousand rubles on some site. I wrote to the website, they immediately returned my money. And Google said, no fucking way, clean transactions, that's it, and they refused.
And I had to do it through the bank, a chargeback.
Speaker 2:
Yes, this is a very strange story. That is, we have a banal life situation on small numbers, but it is viable. If, for example, you have your card. You have a wife. The wife took your card, linked it to some subscription in Apple or Google, it doesn't matter. You will see that you have a charge from Apple or Google. You will go to your subscriptions, you will see, you have no subscription. And you do not understand who is charging you. But she does this all the time.
Speaker 1:
By the way, this is a whole niche of children's applications, mainly, it exists in subscriptions for what children take and buy a lot of things from their parents' phones, uncontrollably.
Sergey:
But is Apple fighting or not?
Speaker 1:
They get a percentage.
"Prison is an expensive pleasure"
Sergey:
Now, when Qiwi burst, I lost 9000 rubles, at the time of closing I had, well, okay. Well, it's bearable. But here's what's funny to you, I was released in 2016, I earned a million two hundred dollars from all my money during this criminal career, but prison is an expensive business, lawyers are for a mobile phone, so that I can have normal food, without excesses.
Prison is a very expensive pleasure, to sit in prison normally, it depends on the prison and so on, 2-3 thousand dollars 2-3 thousand dollars a year, not per year, but per month. Well, it's like in a hotel in Egypt. Yes, or in the budget Maldives. The Maldives have become cheap now. And it turns out that I came to Moscow in 2016, I had 30 thousand dollars left in my pocket.
From this limit, right? Yes, even more. And 30k, and it turns out that I even received investments in cashback. This is the only project with which I have investors. Then I sponsor everything myself. And I have 100 thousand dollars in investments, 30 of my own, but Moscow is an expensive city, here and there, and programmers-developers, and everything, and a year goes by, and I have nothing to eat. I had a period in the spring, I remember, I had nothing to eat for two days, well, nothing at all.
That's it, I had to pay for the apartment, for the Internet, but that's it, but there was no money for food. Then it somehow flew in, I met some good guys on my life's path, I even started a channel then, I think, just from subscribers, from referees who just threw me a grand or two for free, there, for living, well, that's it, they just had money, I didn't, well, some kind of sympathy, I thought, the cops, maybe some, you know... - You're already old, right? - The FSB, there, the cops, well, checked, there, made various gaskets, no, I don't think so.
Why didn't you fix the first term?
Speaker 2:
Listen, I was interested in this question, I don’t remember, maybe you answered it somewhere in the video, it turns out that you sat there twice, after the second time your whole story is white, you went into products, into brand development, into yourself, that is, you started going to people, working, let’s say, but why, that is, this is after the second time, why not after the first, where is this failure, what is the difference?
Sergey:
Well, the first time everything went too softly, there is this general regime first, well, not general reinforced, but this is for first-timers, plus a short term, very 2.5 years, only my trials lasted 1.5 years, and then, in order to sit until some kind of replacement with chemistry, I sat for another year, in short, well, such 2.5 years, of which 1.5 years you are in a daze just hanging out there, smoking there and that's it, well, and I did not understand anything, did not draw any conclusions at all, the second time I was in the camps already, and harsh ones, I was in the best zones in the country, where everyone has a back door from a mobile phone three phones, and then I was in almost the reddest, the second reddest zone, and that's it, I have already been there everywhere, I already know such things for myself, what I am capable of both for good and for bad, and I did such self-analysis, I already understood that such a cockerel, like in this zone, well, everything is brutal there, and so, well, at six in the morning the alarm rang the siren you didn't get up at 601 you can already go to the isolation ward but that's all there the beds are laid out on white there he hasn't shaved there like that I wouldn't go naturally and you wouldn't even go and you wouldn't even go because I have a friend now valik hi he lives in Sweden he has a black guy with me some Belarusian but black and his stubble grows very quickly so he shaves in the morning he has black stubble, he goes already in the evening at 16 o'clock from the industrial area, they stop him, they write a report that you are not shaved, he explains, yes I shaved in the morning, he really shaved, it just grows quickly, and so I realized in such zones that I don't want to end up there, I end up there time after time because I do something wrong, I have much more potential and I don't want to engage in pure crime, plus crime is, as a rule, you you go, whoever you are, whatever your qualifications, well, except for swindlers, probably, but you go within the framework of some chosen craft.
Here someone is a burglar, someone is a pickpocket, someone steals cars, someone steals money from cards, but it limits, you understand? It does not limit business, it gives you a bunch of connections, it gives you synergy between your own projects or mine and yours, and so on, and this is much more interesting.
Speaker 2:
The question of fast money, unfortunately.
Sergey:
Fast, but not easy. They say easy money, like crime is easy, no,
Speaker 2:
It is not easy.
Speaker 1:
A 20-year-old kid, hungry, I don’t know, an orphan or someone else, that he needs to do a long day.
Speaker 2:
So Sergey could not explain to himself after the first time what he needed to do.
Sergey:
But I have a theory, because sometimes I consult people who write dissertations. Well, as a rule, in Switzerland, in Britain, someone I know just talks about cybercrime. I have my own theory of why people go into cybercrime, but especially earlier. That is, I associate it with the fact that we had total poverty, sort of, yes.
In families, and brains were barely present, the Soviet technical school was not destroyed, computers appeared, this is the second factor, technical school, brains, and the third factor, the complete absence of moral education completely. My mother often told me there, I remember, in childhood, that stealing is a sin, but she did not say why it is a sin.
Speaker 1:
But you also understand this Soviet hypocrisy, like we are all friends, on the other hand, everything is common, which means everything is mine, he stole work, yes, he steals everything, a screw that he never did in his life, yes, yes, that is, this is like at the state level, everything was done there, we bow to Lenin and then there.
Speaker 2:
In principle, it remained normal at the everyday level, that is, I don’t know, bread, if you work in gastronomy, that you brought bread home, this is normal.
Speaker 1:
I’m telling you, this is general communism, this is everything for everyone according to their needs. He took it home, that’s all.
The Boomerang Law
Sergey:
By the way, there is one very simple measure to avoid doing bad things, I try to apply it constantly now. You also heard 100% in childhood, treat others the way you want. Don't treat others the way you don't want to be treated. It seems like a word, each of us, of you, has heard it 10 times in our lives, but now I apply it to situations where it arises, where I can deceive someone, pay someone extra, and it seems like who knows, this is something, this devil will sit on this shoulder or not, this is how you can do it, in short, but I hop somehow already, well with age, probably, with experience they come after prison.
And you are not so hungry anymore. I learned to switch, and I would like my partner to do something like that to me, no, I would be unpleasant, and that's it, and you let it go, and you move strictly morally.
Speaker 2:
Well, it's the same thing, I used to look at many things from a different perspective, but as you get older, as you have money, you start to look at things kinder in fact, you're like, well, why, what's the difference, why throw it away, why this, it doesn't solve anything, it doesn't make you feel any better, but you're in harmony with yourself and, in principle, I don't know, I used to be so philosophical about it, someone there, well, you can look at laws differently, citizens working in government agencies have an expression, how do they say, if you're not in jail yet, it's not your merit, it's our shortcoming, that's the kind of thing. And now I think, well, guys, why do something like that, look, it's the 21st century, the Internet, offline, online.
Sergey:
But we need to know about this, you see, it's a big problem, that is, we thought, you and I, that all the world's knowledge would flow there via this Internet and so on, and there would be fewer stupid people, and fewer poor people. And there are more stupid people, because it suits their interests.
Speaker 1:
He slips it in.
Sergey:
They watch A4 and that's it, that is, instead of some educational products, earnings and so on, and that's it. It turns out that our dreams, thanks to whom, yes, YouTube and Facebook, went to hell.
Speaker 1:
Well, in fact, maybe they never existed. And regarding the fact that, well, I just do the same, I go there, you know, with the youth, young guys, I communicate, I also philosophize there, damn, so, so, so, but on the other hand, if I look at myself soberly, damn, I think, it’s just, well, I’ve already earned some money, and I don’t have that grip anymore, plus age, I think, fuck it, fuck it to take risks, but it’s another matter when you’re 16-20, your hormonal level is different, these guys just need to know cases, that is, you can’t teach them in any way, it’s just, for example, your case, it’s like a biblical one, that is, you kind of fell for… you were seduced by money, and you kind of paid for it.
And so you tell it on the Internet. And that’s cool, that is, it can really teach them. And if you sit there, you know, I don’t know, in fashionable clothes, expensive ones, in a Lamborghini and say “guys, money can’t buy happiness,” then it looks hypocritical.
Sergey:
In my situation, it’s also a shame that I could have earned more money legally.
Speaker 1:
Well, in your situation, even in all honesty, there aren’t any super millions on carding, i.e. your payment didn’t match your income from it, i.e. there are a bunch of guys, we discussed them behind the scenes, who earned much more and didn’t pay for it in any way, maybe they have a different kind of luck or something else.
Speaker 2:
Is it a shame that they didn’t pay for it?
Speaker 1:
Yes, I feel bad for Seryoga, if he had 50 straps, and he had some buried somewhere, then it would look better somehow.
What kind of "Zen" and "happiness" is there in prison
Sergey:
Yes, 100%. But you see, history has no subjunctive mood, so it was good. I often ask the heroes of my episodes, from Katya, 10-15 years ago, would you change anything, right? And not a single one, even with tough stories, even tougher than me, would say, no, everything is great, I wouldn't change those. Everything is cool.
Sometimes I even miss that state, because in the zone you are caught at a certain time, when you already know, you have gone through all the stages of complaints, you already understand that well, that's it, I've already done everything, nothing depends on me anymore, just sit. Will I be able to get out earlier? Well, okay. It won't work out, but you sit. And that's it. And you relax, you have this Zen, your day becomes normal, you go, sleep, go to the gym, the rain goes away, and you, like a fool, blissfully walk down the street in the rain, yes, and you just relax your brain. And now I can achieve this state only in two cases.
When I'm standing under the shower, I can stand there for an hour, the water drains, I'm kind of dumbfounded, I think, well, by the way, the most insight and the most connections, here are the answers to the questions I couldn't find about business, I have hop, this moment happens. And the second one, when I'm washing the dishes. Here. And in the zone, this state is common, so I even miss it, but this means that I'm just tired of the information noise that surrounds us. Thousands of channels, telegram channels, calls, phone calls.
Speaker 1:
Oh, tell me, by the way, somewhere I heard this opinion that in the life of every person, regardless of the situation, for example, whether he is in the zone or in the Maldives, there is about the same amount of happiness and unhappiness. Well, that is, like just in the zone, you get a kick out of a ray of light, some tastier bread, I don’t know, something else, and there in the Maldives, it all rubs off on you and it’s like it’s gone, and anyway, this
level is always maintained, that’s what your experience is.
Speaker 2:
You just had different stages, by which you can make a good, interesting selection.
Sergey:
Well, Solzhenitsyn noticed this in “The Zone”, I even stole his quote for my book, the book, by the way, is called “How I Stole a Million”, by the way, it’s a great book, I recommend it to everyone, everyone.
Speaker 2:
Thank you, I recommend reading it.
Sergey:
There he writes, and I, accordingly, that, he says, in the zone, like, all these feelings, they are hypertrophied, that is, and a carrot stub that you managed to get somewhere or a whole one, yes, it evokes more pleasant emotions there than, I don’t know, a Lamborghini there that your second father gave you for your birthday, well, and I felt it on myself, because I had something to compare it with,
when in the carding times, my mother and I were cleaning the house, what did I have, well, when I was already living separately, when I was carding, and she finds some kind of package, well, this one in appearance, there, a tissue package, but square, she says that this, I say, is fucking awesome, she says, if it’s money, half of it is mine, there, I say, well, screw it, like, well, that’s it, in short, well, it was money, it was, I don’t know, in the area, there, maybe 6, maybe 10 thousand dollars, well, fuck, in short, I added 500 dollars to her.
Vitalik laughed like that once, I found 7 thousand euros in the car. Well, I did the same. Plus or minus comparable money. Well, I was happy, well, look how you and I amazed him, oh, great, everything is there. And that's it, well, when in the zone I found, in short, a kilogram of these truffle pyramid candies, yes. Where did you find them? In my bag. Well, I just forgot that they were there. And a kilogram of these candies, and packs, probably 4 Liptons in pyramids, there are all sorts of forest herbs, well, like forest berries, what the hell for tea is this.
I was happy, well, much brighter, more, and more, yes, than these 6 thousand dollars, yes. Because, well, the measure of things simply changes and that's it. Well, and then it rolls back again, here already, well...
Speaker 2:
Well, you're a human being, you get used to everything, you know. You seem to be smart at the moment, but then it all dulls. A little experience remains, but it moves on.
Sergey:
So don't get involved in crime at all, you'll regret it later. So I was lucky, you know, that there, well, my parents are alive there, this and that. That is, someone ends up in the zone, with someone the wife immediately divorces from the first days, the mother dies, the father refuses, well, there are different, yes, brothers and sisters do not talk to you, because you're a moron, and not a respectable family.
And that's all, therefore, and under such circumstances you can generally go nuts.
Speaker 2:
No, yes, guys, of course, that is, we are discussing different ways to make money online, but anything that crosses the line of the law, we strongly advise against, let's call it that.
Speaker 1:
Yes, there are some internal relationships with corporations, for example, in our mobile applications you can violate guidelines somewhere and, for example, Apple or Google can ban you, but nevertheless you do not violate the law in any way, these are your internal business dealings with this corporation. Another thing is to go to someone and actually steal something, because, for example, carding or something like that, it is no different from stealing a person's wallet, for example.
Speaker 2:
Or crypto call centers are also there. I just hate them.
Stories about call centers
Speaker 1:
By the way, in your opinion, we just have a wild number of these callers in Ukraine. Dnepr, Evhark. Yes, yes, yes, it's just such a horror, such, well, such a dogradaniya of society. And on the other hand, young people really have nowhere to go. For example, I have a younger sister there, she has a bunch of friends there who are trying to find a normal job. And from the jobs, they are a crypto caller, onlyfans, maybe some arbitrage, farmer. This is already like a high-level in comparison with this.
Speaker 2:
They are still two-sided.
Speaker 1:
Yes, and this is also no better, in fact.
Sergey:
This story surprises me. Sometimes they call me too. One called under the garbage, mowed down. I generally react nervously when the authorities call me, because they call me, because they call me, it happens. Well, and then I think, again these five, well, at one moment, or scammers. Then I look, he says, Sergei Pavlovich is there, I think, well, it's clear, there will be a goose. He's teasing me from some investigator. And I listened and listened, turned on the dictaphone, I still have people sitting, we are sitting in my office.
There was someone who came to film, Vlad was sitting there, and I was here in the middle. I was telling him, and then I got fed up, it was already recorded, I said, listen, go to hell. He said, what, are you an employee? I said, what kind of employee are you? If you were an employee, you would know that I am not Pavlovich, but Aleksandrovich, and Pavlovich is just my last name, in short, that's it. But in general, to be honest, I am very surprised at how stupid people are in general, well, on Earth, yes. There is an article on LURK that says, LURK is blocked, well, guys, get a VPN, buy it and go to LURK, LURK more.
Speaker 1:
Better partner with us at forestall.Com, buy our motivated traffic, set up your own application and don't know any grief.
Sergey:
Yes. And there was such a funny article written in their style, that 95% of people are idiots all over the world, well, in general, from the whole planet. I don’t agree about 95, I think it’s still somewhere around 80 probably. Well, really, yes, idiots. And in this regard, I’m surprised at what these callers are up to. Just honestly, that….
Speaker 1:
Just what a volume of this, even I have some acquaintances there from the media bank, who are somehow connected, there, they pour traffic or something else into these things, they just come, for example, there’s an affiliate world conference, and these people have a million stands there, and they show them straight diagrams of market growth, like some kind of venture business.
In Finland, we have 100 million suckers, you can screw so many more.
Speaker 2:
There was such a funny movie with Steadham “The Beekeeper”. Bad movie, so-so awful, but the funny thing is that Hollywood is making a movie about crypto-code centers, a movie with Steadham, it's a bit childish.
Speaker 1:
So how much jam did we have there, the whole city was just abandoned, that is, the volume of it is just so incredible.
Speaker 2:
Wait, I'll give you a spoiler. Do you know who ended up owning the crypto call center in the movie with Steadham? The son of the US president. At the end of this whole chain was the son of the US president.
Sergey:
Neither Gram nor Biden.
Speaker 1:
Hunter Biden. - Some dude told me that he was in Interpol, because he was pouring traffic into this thing and through their traffic they screwed some senator in the US for half a billion bucks. And another guy also told me that he worked somewhere in an Israeli call center, and at the next table the guy fucked over the Prince of Dubai, and they spent a week drinking. Because they are their enemies, you understand?
In short, there are stories like that.
Sergey:
Well, of course, they are curious about what they were up to, right? Well, what was it before the war? In short, there was a channel in Telegram, I don’t know if it’s still there or not, it’s an office thing, we’re friends there, well, those Ukrainians who work in call centers, well, the top ones there, let’s say. In short, they leaked, they record everything, and the funniest cases, the wildest cases, they leaked to this channel. It was there privately, everything. And there it was before the war, well now it’s clear that, yes, arson of military registration and enlistment offices, there, pouring green paint in polling stations, there, somehow throwing a Molotov cocktail at the prosecutor’s house or throwing a Molotov cocktail and so on.
But before the war they just leaked, you look, it seems, and what’s there, both old and young, you look, well, mostly women were stupid, of course. By the way, I practically never saw men, no offense to women, but that’s how it happened. The girl there is 18 years old, let's say, well, not 18, 20 years old, really young. Or there is an aunt there, 40, 50 years old even, already a granny.
They, imagine, force them there, well, maybe it was you who called from Ukraine, I don't know. But they force them, that is, she comes up, they tell her to take biometrics, to undress. She stands up completely, spreads her arms, becomes like this Vitruyan man, they film, they say, now we can't film, come closer to the camera, turn your back, bend over, and that's it, and so on, and I think, my God, how do they do this, isn't this a fake?
Speaker 2:
You understand that they are still driving, that is, they have already done the work, of this word, please, step.
Speaker 1:
Another guy told me that he worked with them somewhere, and in this call center, the head there, well, usually it's a Jewish topic, the head was Jewish, and their top sales manager was his seven-year-old son. He taught, like, how to make money from an early age. It's just that when I was doing media buying, there were a million temptations to somehow upload traffic there or something like that, but for me it's just complete moral madness.
It's just the ultimate scam and people really commit suicide. It's not like, you know, ripping someone off for $50, it's people selling apartments right there, and then they call them, their relatives, and tell them.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, I think exactly the same, absolutely, considering. Well, to be fair, there's money, of course they just pressure you with money there. Well, because there's just money there. That is, you just take it. If we take the same card that's there. That is, there is no cost. There is no spender, they just transfer cryptocurrency over the phone. You just understand, in your card, as it was, you could empty the card, yes, but conditionally many cards were insured even if a case of fraud was discovered later.
Sergey:
Well, yes, some from a dolam, in my opinion, is not desirable.
Speaker 2:
And here's the story, that is, they can screw someone, this someone is with him, if he transferred the money himself, that's the whole point of it all. If a person transferred the money himself, it's not an insurance case. If it's not a virus, they didn't know anything. Well, that's it, and the person there, a pensioner or a young man, loses all his money absolutely.
Which banks are better?
Sergey:
Because you confirmed it via FaceID. Well, what's the beauty of American banks? Our applications, let's say, Ukrainian banking ones, they are the best in the world objectively. I have 10 European state banks there, there are several, well, these neobanks, Revolut, Vice, I have all this, and I can compare. The American ones are very bad, yes, it’s about the same level as Thailand, you have to come for every reason, I forgot to reissue my card, come, I came, I say, reissue me a card, I came with my passport, they say, where is your checkbook, I need it, I have a passport, yes, a phone, which is here, call me, here I have a passport, a phone, no, bring the checkbook, I went, stood there for two hours, then the American banks are about the same system, but at the same time all ours do not return your money to you in case of fraud or something else, and the American ones do, they are bad, but they are reliable, well, except for individual cases when they go bankrupt, like Silicon Will Bank there, but nevertheless, this is a big difference, and therefore, as if, on the one hand, I have no particular reason to love the Americans, yes, on the other hand, I have respect for them, respect of what kind, that they all after all, well, they care a little about their own citizens, their own, they don't give a damn about others. That is, look, if someone arrests a Russian in any country, they immediately start fussing about, well, not a Russian, but, I mean, an American, they immediately try to help, pull him out and so on. They
don't abandon their own, as they say.
Speaker 2:
By the way, it's the opposite with Russians, some famous Russians, that is, Russians say, they don't abandon their own, but... No, well, yes. Many are still resting.
"Lord of War"
Sergey:
Yes, but now it's only concern that they pulled the masses so widely because of Krasikov, "Lord of War" was filmed based on his motives.
Speaker 1:
I didn't know that this would happen yet, I watched it, yes, I also watched a cool film about it, how is the actor there, I don't forget Nicholas Cage, yes, and now he's somehow become an alcoholic.
Sergey:
How is he, he, he is a criminal, he is Francis Ford Coppola's nephew, Sofia Coppola is his cousin, he doesn't care, but that's not how I found out either, I just saw that he was drinking all the time and now he always has shitty films there. That's why, firstly, they don't abandon their own, and secondly, they really act tough and are edifying to the whole world, showing that don't bother us, we will get you at any time, even in 20-30 years.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, you see, even internet scammers, former scammers, if everyone knows unspoken, don't touch America. Reputation speaks for itself, so to speak.
Sergey:
Well, plus they forgave me, that's the third reason, respect and love, well, how did they forgive me, well, they admitted that it's an absurd situation, let's close Pavlovich's case, thank God, and that same prosecutor just closed a case against another person who's very important to me, I'm already thinking about it, in short, his name is Orlando, I'm already thinking about slapping something here, Orlando, the American flag, because I have American Express on my shoulder, like, the American Express emblem, yeah, and now Orlando will be here, yeah, the sheriff will pick him up,
Let's sum it up.
Speaker 1:
What can we sum it up, guys? I realized from our conversation that there's no point in doing dirty work, there are more minuses than pluses.
Sergey:
Possible minuses.
Speaker 1:
Well, possible, of course, yes, until we do it. What can you do? You can come to Sergey, if you are a blogger, in the cashback service for an affiliate, take a coupon, share with him a referral for the services he makes, just watch his cool content, use his VPN, download, pre-order vodka, a book, buy a book if you haven't bought it.
Socks, well, the whole set. You can come to us for an affiliate for organic mobile applications, buy motivated traffic in Foros.Com, buy the WebView application App4Rent.Com, pour it into our application Traffic4.Partners, watch our YouTube channel and subscribe to all channels and go to our closed community of mobile developers and affiliate marketers in Telegram.
There will be a link here.
Sergey:
And also go to Google, in short, and simply enter the name of your company in the search bar. For partners. It would be super. And light apps, and that's it. To cheat behavioral.
Speaker 1:
And the books of Sergey Pavlovich, which do not need advertising.
Sergey:
Cheating PF. By the way, it's strange, it still works in Yandex. He does nothing about it, he doesn't care. It doesn't work in Google, they can't bypass all sorts of protections there. But in Yandex he made a bot farm, he collected cookies. That's it, please, that's it.
Speaker 2:
If I give a short summary, that is, what's the story. There is money on the Internet, if you are a blogger, you just don't know what to do, how to make money, come to Sergey, Sergey simply tells you turnkey, you can here, here, here, here, study and you will have millions. If you work with apps or with traffic, damn, we already have so many services, just come to us, write to Dima, write to me.
Speaker 1:
More services than non-services.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, you just say, guys, I'm a marketer, okay, you come to our affiliate program then. You say, guys, I'm a developer, okay, you come to us to partner with for motivated traffic.
Speaker 1:
I want to work, you come to us or to Sergey to work. We just give you everything, the main thing is not to card and deceive people.
Speaker 2:
Less black stuff, a lot of white stuff, welcome. A lot of white stuff, that's good. Yeah, yeah. Well, thank you.
Contents:
- Intro
- Sergey Pavlovich is a guest of the podcast
- "Where to drain the stolen money?"
- About Arbitration
- Favorite traffic sources
- About love for SEO and organic traffic
- "Is there any money on the internet?"
- Niches for making money on the Internet
- Earnings on coupons
- Income from the People PRO channel
- Service for bloggers
- Earnings on a personal brand, MrBeast
- Merch designer
- Functionality of the service for bloggers
- Income from the People PRO channel
- Telegram bot with night butterflies
- How to find an idea for making money
- Total income of Sergei Pavlovich
- Varlamov's top-notch earnings
- "I'm number 1 in this"
- About the desire to develop
- "Is Carding Alive!?"
- About carder gatherings
- Money laundering through crypto
- Consequences of breaking the law before the United States
- How to drain carzhennye funds
- Data theft via Wi-Fi
- Benefits of Using a VPN
- Cashing out stolen money
- How Sergey was scammed
- "Prison is an expensive pleasure"
- Why didn't you fix the first term?
- The Law of the Boomerang
- What kind of "Zen" and "happiness" is there in prison?
- Stories about call centers
- Which banks are better?
- "Lord of War"
- Let's sum it up
Intro
Sergey:
What are we going to talk about today? Well, about money.
Speaker 1:
Where should we drain the embezzled money?
Sergey:
I think I'm number one at this.
Speaker 2:
Cars, vans, girls, drugs. You were corrupted by money, and you kind of paid for it.
Sergey:
Prison is an expensive business. Three phones for everyone, there's a back door. A kind of a pit house, like in this zone.
Speaker 2:
You can here, here and there, study, and you'll have millions.
Speaker 1:
I think they offered a billion dollars for the channel.
Sergey:
I'm not a blogger, I'm an entrepreneur first and foremost.
Speaker 1:
Maybe Interpol will come there and just rake everyone in.
Sergey:
About 120 million dollars a year in liabilities. I come, and they tell me - zero.
Sergey Pavlovich – podcast guest
Speaker 1:
Hello, guys. Another evening with us on the Light Apps Podcast channel. Today we have a really cool guest – Sergey Pavlovich. He is one of the top YouTubers in the CIS. He wrote a book that needs no introduction and served 10 years in prison specifically for you. For you.
Sergey:
For you, for us and for the special forces.
Speaker 1:
That’s why, guys, you need to listen to this topic very, very carefully.
We definitely won’t take people like that into reconnaissance.
Speaker 2:
Yes, guys, hello everyone, it’s hard to interrupt such an intro, so I’ll just say it briefly, we’ll try to bring up some interesting topics. I think Sergey and I will definitely have something to talk about. That is, everything you like. The Internet, money, something gray. In general, let’s talk about Sergey.
Sergey:
Sex, drugs, rock and roll, if we’re talking about me specifically. Glad to see everyone on the new channel, yes, I like coming to new channels. And with my presentation, quite a few specialists, like you, have become bloggers. Glad to meet you here, subscribe. Saw me, subscribed. In principle, you should already have it as a reflex. And what are we going to talk about today? Well, about money, right? Well, let's talk about money.
"Where to drain the stolen money?"
Speaker 1:
We have a lot of Internet audiences, so to speak, zarabitchani, people who want to make money on the Internet, make money on mobile applications, on traffic arbitrage, and so on. And they are very interested in the question of where to drain the embezzled money?
Sergey:
They want to earn money, and preferably earn a lot. Well, where to drain the stolen money, it would be better to ask Slobozhenko. I think. I'm kidding, I have a good attitude towards Sasha, but I once talked to my friend and said, listen, is Slobozhenko a normal arbitrator? He says, I don't know what kind of arbitrator he is, but he's definitely a good carder. That's the joke Sasha has on the Internet. So, well, about arbitration, if so.
About Arbitration
Sergey:
Personally, I don't really like arbitration, because I don't like routine things. Even in a day, I have a problem, we have 30 projects, even more, 30 of which have not yet been launched. In short, there are a lot of projects, but I'm not patient, I can't do one all day. I need to do something else every hour or two. That is, I swim a day, giving instructions on about four projects. And all this routine activity, I would definitely not be able to work as a Jeweler. And as an arbitrator, too.
Favorite sources of traffic
Sergey:
Because you need creativity, flight, doing repetitive things, but somehow it’s not for me at all. But with all this, I’m arbitraging now, but I like it when traffic is free. Therefore, my two favorite sources of traffic, naturally, are YouTube. I have my own channel “People of Prona” 830 thousand, a number of others, a network of entire channels.
And SEO, naturally, because SEO, there are not such complicated rules, yes, that is, in fact, SEO now comes down to what on the Internet? It comes down to the technicality of the site, you should have normal epogenations, canonical, hreflang and everything else, if you have a multilingual site, you should have bread circles and so on. That is, just basic rules, some kind of checklist that any SEO specialist can, therefore, master very quickly.
Plus usability. As a business owner, I put myself in my clients' shoes and understand that this button is stupid, I wouldn't click it here, it's inconvenient. Especially now. I didn't have this understanding before, but now, when projects come one after another, it's common sense. And that's why when Dima, Vitalik and I were talking on my channel, Dima said something absolutely wonderful, that you should work for hire. But I have something to add to that.
That is, work for hire in the area that is potentially interesting to you, that you are good at, that your soul lies in. You will gain experience, you will not make mistakes that you could make with your own money. You will not make them anymore, because you will be working in a corporation. And then you always gain experience, and leave there. That's why I prefer YouTube and SEO from arbitration. SEO, when you have already debugged and so on, it comes down to what? To writing articles, essentially, expanding the semantic base, yes, and a very fast site.
Because Mobile First now, because even when we go to Google PageSpeed, we see that they have already moved the mobile version to the first place, and a very fast site, and that's it. Well, naturally, we have a tool, it's all who... arbitrageurs, I don't know if they use it or not, but SEOs, Ahrefs is the same. Ahrefs is all the rage, basically. You see the semantic base of competitors and so on, you see the approximate traffic for each keyword.
And it's interesting, that is, it's clear that in trust, for example, I have coupon sites, yes. It's clear that in the top there are trusted sites, which have 10-15 years of dominance there. I'm interested in navareg. I tried to muddle SEO there, screw the system, buy drops there, old dominance there, but it all doesn't work. That is, you take navareg and just make a normal site. Here, and SEO traffic, it is the most targeted, it is valued everywhere, both in your field and in any of ours.
Speaker 2:
Well, look, as you said about your YouTube channel, yes, it is a good channel, I watched it a long time ago, I remember, I was even a kid, I tried something... Kid not in terms of age, but in terms of intelligence, you know, I wanted to learn some new information. I watched it, super interesting content, you have a very unusual story from the beginning, how you go and move on.
About love for SEO and organic traffic
Speaker 2:
About SEO, I would say, you say you like SEO, not Arbitrash, but the SEO part, I like it too.
For example, we have ASO, and this is one of my favorite niches. That is, if we take there, you buy traffic, it's cool, but ASO is just like a money button.
Sergey:
For me, it's like meditation. That is, I can write articles for websites, menu items, change, arrange, translate a website. Well, I just like tinkering with it. Some people like cars, yes, I like tinkering with websites.
"Is there money on the Internet?"
Speaker 2:
And if we take money specifically, that is, let's ask a simple question. Is there money on the Internet?
Sergey:
Yes, of course, of course, huge.
Speaker 2:
Everyone just knows most about arbitration, that is, if we take arbitration. Can we consider something other than arbitration, do you have a lot of experience?
Sergey:
Development, development, that is, well, the agency model, yes, when you develop Aprils or custom websites for someone, as you said in our last issue, media buying, I don't like it at all, it's not that profitable. You depend on clients, a lot of approvals, running after them, calling them. You need to have good salespeople, you need to train salespeople, especially, probably, an important part of the job, and that's it. But this is work with a large number of clients.
Development, here is an example from yours, from the mobile environment, just Gursky, I think, Yuri, from Belarus, this is the application "Masks on the light of God" Masquerade. Masquerade, yes. Then he has some other one now on yoga or mental health, there is something cool, some, well, startups that are sold for hundreds of millions of dollars. Here, a regular application, yes. Well, I have not yet managed to create such, but unfortunately, I have not paid attention to the mobile niche for a long time.
Basically, all my projects that bring me money or that I develop, they are primarily, well, web. That is, it has never happened that we initially develop only an application right away. I always have a web and some application for it.
Speaker 1:
Well, like with the VPN that you have, which is this one. But, as far as I understand, you are going to make a mobile version. That's it.
Speaker 2:
And regarding Gursky, as you said, the masquerade, there is actually a cool story there, how it all works. It's simple, look, from the outside it seems like the guys made a product, sold it successfully, right? But in fact, there is a whole business model there. That is, there are applications, like we do. These are products that we buy herbs there, or we move organics, a different story. And this is a slightly different niche of products. So, what is the essence there? There are some products that are inflated by hype.
That is, when they reach a certain peak, you need to sell them in time.
Sergey:
But they sold it to a strategist, they sold it to Facebook.
Speaker 2:
And everything is fine.
Sergey:
And, you know, even Facebook is not interested in this application. They took the technology.
Speaker 2:
For all these products, your key must be technology. Because you need to sell it, otherwise what, Dima?
Speaker 1:
Otherwise, you'll go broke.
Speaker 2:
Yes, that's how it works. If they hadn't managed to sell, the technology would have fallen, and operationally they wouldn't have been invented.
Sergey:
Well, it's definitely a skill, a hunch, probably. That is, it is unknown whether Gursky's action is based on analysis, yes, or on hunch. Both have an equal right to exist, and many move by hunch. For example, I move only by hunch, I'm shitty with mathematics, a true pure humanities scholar, so only by hunch.
Niches for earning money on the Internet
Sergey:
But if we go back to niches, to niches of earning money on the Internet, arbitration is also clear, applications are also clear, you can make ones like the guys do, they are ordered to download just money, I don’t like it, I like creativity more, That is, therefore, development, application of some startups. And in applications there is a lot of money in some in general, but I also like the e-commerce sphere. That is, since I also come from arbitration, that is, I have cashback, now I have coupons.
Speaker 1:
And vodka?
Sergey:
And vodka, and this is a small circulation, this is a limited edition, it’s like closing the gestalt, I really don’t like unfinished business. And I succeed, I closed this case with imprisonment, after 13 years I finished it, but there was a project started, but it needs to be finished. Sometimes it’s worth quitting, but I can’t do that yet, they are like my children, I like to raise them a little. And in e-commerce, for example, there is a lot of money.
Earnings on coupon sites
Sergey:
For example, there is a Western coupon site RetailMinute, it was recently sold for a half yard, well, not recently, about 5 years ago, but it downloads approximately just a site on the Internet, a site on the Internet, which downloads approximately 150 million dollars in profit per year on coupons. There are other models. I also found an interesting point with coupon sites. Each major American media outlet, be it Forbes, CNN and so on, they have a coupon site.
It often hangs on a subdomain, for example, coupons.forbes.com or coupons.cnn.com. And I noticed in my e-commerce research, searches, that 100% of them are given a coupon fit by one supplier, because Forbes has it, which means it is everywhere, and vice versa. And I still could not get to the bottom of who gives it to them, I kind of look for that cell, but I just could not.
And then I accidentally look at the Forbes website, in the header there are coupons provided to us by some company, well, this is a policy of openness, all things are according to the law, but they removed it after two months, but I was lucky, I just managed to suck in who it was, I went to their website, I see that some kind of contour is there, and I won’t just say the name, look for it yourself, Canadian, and what did they do, they made a coupon site that is not the coolest, not at all with the largest number of coupons, they just did it a long time ago, five years ago, and they shoved in their own, finished coupon site,
they stuck a large source of traffic, and I looked at this model, and I collected a huge pack of coupons for my other business, I just have collected, well, probably more than anyone else in the world, now we'll delete duplicates, well, 1150-200 active coupons will be there and I thought, well, why shouldn't I repeat this model, but they didn't cover, for example, segments, yes, they didn't cover large media, but they didn't even cover in America, there are some giant forums, they didn't cover, that is, Brazilian media in Brazil. They didn't cover, for example, Poland, that is, there are plenty of markets to come to, so I made a first-class coupon site specifically for interlinking by sections, by convenience, by everything, having looked at that, well, of course, I can't afford that. And this office, yes, at least, it earns 20 million a year. I don't know in what proportion they saw with the traffic source, with Forbes, for example, but they claim that they have about 20 million dollars a year in passive income.
Once they made, in fact, a business, yes. And I like such businesses, and I did, since I myself am from the blogging environment, I made a dome, which I will now give on a turnkey basis, I don't know, there, to the media and bloggers in particular, because the blogging niche is not closed, especially now. You are drowning, oh, how can we earn money, we are not agents.
Income from the People PRO channel
Sergey:
Well, I have 1.1 million in profit last year from the channel, that is, well, how, to earn your products, of course, first of all.
In America, how do bloggers earn money? They don't wait. We have integration in the Russian-speaking environment. You wait for an advertiser to come, yes, and there he is a brand, he earns a lot on merch and earns money by creating some of his own products, someone comes to them in partnership, so I can give a coupon tomorrow in Orla, I can develop, I go in this direction to make some product and give it out en masse, or I also collected for my own internal needs, I needed to make referral links to products for our one application, and it turned out as if by accident that I collected the largest number of stores in the world under my hood.
Service for bloggers
Sergey:
And now I have the largest CPA network, and we made a simple interface, it will probably work already, when the release comes out. It already works, just list the interface.
In essence, what are you doing? You are a blogger. You are a blogger, but you sell your services, let's say. And he is a blogger, he is young, he sells no services, no goods, nothing. But he talks well, I don’t know, about… He is a carpenter, planes, hammers, stall-keeper, jack of all trades. And we did… You have nothing to sell of your own, let’s say, for now, but we did it so that you can make a revka in one place for 80 thousand shops.
You go to Walmart, take the hammer you talk about in every video, or a plane, or a chainsaw, and make a referral link. And it's convenient. Why? Why do I make a large structure? Here's the meta, if my memory serves me right, there are 5 thousand shops at CJ, there at Rakuten Advertising, well, they have 3-5 thousand shops. I collected 80, just if a blogger inserted it to us, and there, well, we can't make a referral link, most likely, this means that the store simply does not have a referral program.
And you don't have to go all over the Internet looking for where to make a referral link to it. Everything is in one place. And at the intersection of e-commerce, at the intersection of e-commerce and blogging, I want to spend the next 5 years or so, because both areas are actively developing, and there is money everywhere.
Earnings on a personal brand, MrBeast
Speaker 1:
Well, you're a hottie in this regard, because in fact, in the CIS space, many don't buy out, American dudes like Dan Bilzerian and so on, they earn billions of dollars purely around the product thanks to their name. They release various CBD, clothes and so on. Conventionally, the most popular is Mr. Bit, some chocolates, I watched him, T-shirts.
He was offered a billion dollars for channels, it's not because of the channel, but because it's all together, there, the channel grid, plus e-com, plus the business approach, that is, everything.
Sergey:
Amazon has now paid him a hundred million to film a show for them. Well, that is, in fact, he films for himself, but broadcasts not on his YouTube, but on Amazon Prime.
Speaker 2:
Well, there was a funny story with him, when this billion, what you're talking about, was offered to him, he says, I sat for a while, thought, I would become the youngest billionaire, there, only Kylie Jenner was younger. He says, and then, he says, he figured, why should I take and promote someone else's product, if I have many more views there than any Super Bowl in America. And he says, it's easier for me to make any product of my own there, conditionally. I can make my lemonade, I can make my chips, I can make my courses, as you say, sell a hammer, conditionally.
And that's it, I will earn more with the Mr. Beast brand than I will sell a channel to someone.
Sergey:
There is a problem with this, especially in the CIS, a problem of some kind of lack of centralized platforms where you can make your merch, soda, and so on. And I read Morenes, Arkady Morenes is like that, well, I think that he does the most for the venture market. I read from him, well, we made merch and let's say there is an office, I can link directly to my channel, well, and you will also be able to link over time, when you have more than a thousand subscribers, I think, your own shop, but you need to do it somewhere in some shop.
And so, for example, in the States there is a company, it used to be called T-Spring, and now it is simply called Spring. You can order merch there without leaving your home. That is, you have a designer, the assortment is huge now, when I ordered, there was maybe position 15, now, maybe, there are 200. From a condom to a cartridge, a mug, there, a T-shirt, whatever you want, a cap, a towel. It’s
shitty to put on a towel. And you just upload your logo, you chose, let’s say, a towel, what colors you want. You chose 3-4 colors, took the logo, stretched it, a very convenient designer, that’s it, cool, the future belongs to such products.
Designer for merch
Sergey:
There are none like that in the CIS, there were maybe only two companies, and I read in Morenes that there are some guys who, I understand, this market, they really united, I don’t remember, some British site, and I wouldn’t say if I knew, well, if I remembered.
I’m keeping it for myself. They have a lousy designer, but what did they do? This is generally an office, it’s not a manufacturer, it’s just like Dodo Pizza.
Speaker 1:
Just a marketplace.
Sergey:
Yes, they simply brought an IT component to a disparate business. And they essentially united everyone who prints business cards, watches, all sorts of emblems on watches, in short, mugs and everything else, T-shirts, from any part of the world. They have a shitty designer, unsuccessful so far. But I understand that we will connect them to our blogger app, ecosystem. This is the application you were talking about, right?
Speaker?:
Yes.
Sergey:
Mesh app. Mesh app. Now next year, well, in April there will be an ICO. What did we do? I am an investor in this project, actually. Well, it so happened that I am a player-coach there. A man came. By the way, there were a lot of cool people from Clubhouse. That is, we got to know a lot of people. The director that I told you about backstage, he is American, he wrote to me from there. Well, he saw me there.
And in general, it is very cool. A lot of entrepreneurs. Well, because the most active ones are there.
Speaker 2:
Clubhouse.
Functionality of the service for bloggers
Sergey:
They come out just during the pandemic. And a man came and said that we need to make an app. I will make an app for every blogger there and back. For every blogger. One is a food blogger, the second is beauty, the third is like you, tech, the fourth is, there, lifestyle. And you will simply get tired of supporting 100-200-300. Firstly, customize for every need, secondly, maintain them 200-300-500 – it’s just hell.
And I say, let's make one. Well, we do, we do it for a long time for a number of reasons. We had no experience in applications at all, we made it for three years. You will probably laugh now, being on the channel about the application, but we made it for three years. And we have only made an Android version so far, but now the backsite is normal, the backend. And now we will make, of course, an iPhone version as well. We simply combined all the needs of a blogger and his audience into one application.
Patreon with its paid subscriptions. We made a one-time donation, like a super thank you on YouTube under any type of content. Stories, like on Instagram, but again you can sell your products with your markets. Stories, live broadcasts with the possibility of sale. They even did it like, I don’t know, mamba, they used it once for those familiar with the site, but in general it was a cool thing, you write a figurative comment of some kind, and it hangs there, the king of the mountain was called, until no one, let’s say you put 10 dollars, until no one puts 11, it hangs, and we did it on our own, that is, please, under any post I can go to your profile, under your video or post write a comment, pin it for 50 dollars and wait, maybe it will hang there for a year, in general, it’s cool, you can advertise there, well, of course, if you are some guy, for advertising, that the moderator will take it down, this will be agreed upon, but in general.
Yes, we did things like this, posts like on Instagram, in short, videos, for example, I upload to the YouTube channel, it immediately shows up on the counter, the same with podcasts, events, you can create a concert right away, sell tickets, in short, courses and a market, I would like to dwell on the market in more detail. In the market, physical goods, like I have, for example, physical goods, electronic goods, that is, sell your own soundtracks, please, stripe and crypto are connected, and e-books, for example.
But there is also such a startup, well, like a startup, an existing business, a billion valuation, cameo, for example. If you don’t know what cameo is, it’s just an app where you can order congratulations on video from Jackie Chan, from Obama, from anyone you want, in short. And all this, like all the functions that I’m talking about, they, ah, and here we also sell advertising, well, and blockchain for the transparency of transactions, for blogger investments.
And it seems like everything that I listed to you, it all exists, yes, but it exists in 15 apps. Okay, in 10 apps, but why do I need 10 apps if I want to get everything from a blogger in one place. By the way, this is a big problem for young bloggers. Why did we earn a lot, I probably earned even more this year, because we have a lot of everything, there are channels, publics, a website, there is a website with referral links, where some proven services are recommended by themselves, VPN, there, to proxies and, I don’t know, to stores figuratively, Lamoda and Booking, that’s it.
We just have too much of everything. I counted, we have 15 units with which we pump money to YouTube, that is, YouTube and 14 units.
Income from the People PRO channel
Speaker 1:
By the way, what is the income structure on the channel, that is, from what is it more, from what, well, can you give figures, can you without, or at least reduce it in order?
Sergey:
Before the war it was about 8 thousand dollars with monetization, now it is, well, 800 dollars, in short, it has dropped 10 times. Integrations, a lot of integration and advertising, advertising of their products more. By the way, I am lucky with us, we have such cool advertisers who allow, well, who pay us for advertising, but they also allow us to throw in a roar. Well, it is like, there, on beer, on cognac, well, on caviar, there, well, not the most direct.
Well, 100 thousand, I don’t know, rubles, there, in three months, there, they accumulate, well, and okay, as it were. That is, they already pay another 100 thousand for, that’s it. And most of all, probably, right now, advertising of products, both their own, here are cashbacks, coupons and so on, VPN, and so on, and others. We have some kind of affiliate program, no one else has, and again, I don’t like to work myself, that is, well, it’s not that I don’t like, I like to work, and there’s a lot of work.
I mean, figuratively dividing this affiliate program into 5-10 bloggers, I just say, pour through me, and your income will still be 2 times more than you will pour standardly. And they agree, the guys pour, and that’s it, we just saw off the profit with them 50-50, and it’s profitable for them, and it’s profitable for me too. And with an eye, we get from 70 to 100 per month, now there’s a slight drawdown.
Telegram bot with night butterflies
Sergey:
Then there’s another cool affiliate program, there are also guys who started a business.
The guys did it simply, threw whores into the Telegram bot. That's it, you can call her, meet her there. And the Telegram bot just takes money from you and gives you access to the profiles.
Speaker 1:
Like a marketplace.
Sergey:
Well, that's it, yeah. But nevertheless, the lifetime revka is 50%. You know, and who has their own traffic channels in Telegram and so on, that is, a subscription there costs about 100 dollars a month. That is, it's even cooler than the app.
Speaker 1:
Just to open contacts.
Sergey:
Yes.
How to find an idea for making money
Speaker 2:
You're doing it, you've built the entire current income structure, so to speak, white. Around yourself. Yourself and traffic, and brand. That is, what you were talking about at the beginning. That is, it turns out that you have your brand, you have your traffic, you've been growing it for a long time, now you're trying to monetize it, and you're monetizing it organically, and not in a brutal way. That is, you have different directions that fit organically into working with you. For example, the pinnacle of all this is an application for bloggers.
That is, on a turnkey basis, you can do everything you want there. A must-have application for every blogger, in fact.
Sergey:
Yes, well, I think that it is probably just a lot of projects, well, you see, it is difficult for a founder to single out some of his projects. I like cashback, for example, this is my first major project, and I like this, it is, the potential is most of all in this blogging application. And most of the functions in it are exactly what I like, they were born from my real needs. So I need a hall, yes, I have held many meetings with subscribers, and sooner or later you will hold them with subscribers and colleagues.
And there is a problem. For example, tomorrow I am flying to Vilnius. I do not mind meeting with them. But I need to announce it somewhere widely, as widely as possible, so that as many Lithuanians as possible see it. Then find out how many of you will come. And, as a rule, I exaggerate myself by 4 times. I am already saying this from experience, I write in Telegram, only those who will definitely come vote. Because the hall and the money depend on it.
And still it needs to be divided by 4. And then it still doesn't come and then the most difficult thing is to find a hall and where should I look I don't know Lithuanian I have limited time and that's it and so we do everything through the app that is I sold tickets through announced events in the app sold tickets there is also a ticket scanner for face control well how do you like the URL just on the web the scanner will open for him and that's it and moreover all who bought tickets they immediately get into the general chat someone will go together to get to know someone and in this chat after a meeting or a concert, if there is a music star, chip in photos as material, and that's it. And when, for example, tickets were sold to me, the sale is already closed, the app tells me, do you have a hall in Vilnius for 27 people, or do you need to find? I say, you need to find. And then the application managers, they just throw off 2-3 options, they take from my money, that's it. And you also told there, like your VPN, yes, when you lived in China, that it was born from your personal needs.
And many of my products are born from my needs. And I use all my projects, be it cashback, coupon codes, and so on, every day myself, well, not every day, weekly, but I use them myself.
Speaker 1:
So we can say that you, a, built a personal brand, then, b, make products and thanks to your personal brand you recommend them to people who are subscribed to you, who follow you, they are interested in your life, you recommend products that you use yourself, and on this, in general, you earn, as you said, a million one hundred a year in the area of your channel.
Sergey Pavlovich's total income
Sergey:
Well, no, it's more, we earned a million one hundred purely on advertising, on interviews, on everything, and in total, if you count, last year it was probably 2 million.
Speaker 1:
Two, probably. Well, it turns out to be two million, but this, according to your estimates, is the largest income among CIS YouTubers around this? So, can we say that you are the most enterprising YouTuber?
Sergey:
I don't think so. Why? Because there are very large channels, Varlamov, Sobchak, for whom one advertisement costs, I don't know, 5 thousand dollars, and for them 35, you know, and they insert two or three advertisements. And now, to be honest, it's funny to me to hear, yes, how Varlamov cries that there is no money, PR and so on.
Well, with such prices for advertising, you should save up a safety cushion for 10 years in advance, why the hell are you standing there now?
The highest level of earnings from Varlamov
Speaker 2:
There is a very funny thing, I don't know if you have seen it or not. He flew to different countries, like China, Japan and so on. And it turns out that when he flew to these countries, he compiled a guide to these countries. And at first he asked for a donation, because they did not have enough money for tickets to these countries. Then they sent him a donation, and he flew to these countries, made a guide, and then he published this guide and said, guys, you can get access to it for money, I traveled around the countries especially for you for your money and made a guide, that you fly to the countries.
Sergey:
No, well, Varlamov is a Jew, what are you saying.
Speaker 2:
Well, this is just the highest level of skill.
"I am No. 1 in this"
Sergey:
Yes, but I can't bring myself to ask for this handout there, that's it, but you see, you say, I built a personal brand, I didn't build it, I don't know how to use it. The thing is that in the same Thailand, yes, in many places, yes, you have an Instagram, let's say, from 40 thousand, you can fly in many hotels for free, they upgrade you almost to first class, I don't know how to use it, I don't know how to ask, you have to write it, introduce yourself, say who you are and so on.
Speaker 1:
You need to have a manager for that. Well, how can I say, he doesn't know how. A person who earns 2 million a year around that probably knows how.
Speaker 2:
I agree, but you also had an initially not entirely correct comparison. You say Varlamov, Sobchak. I would compare more, if we take people who have, say, the same number of subscribers... LTV subscriber, yes, that's how we'll take it. The same number of subscribers and that's the monetization of your audience, your brand, you.
On the desire to develop
Sergey:
Well, I think I'm number one in this, I think, yes, with that number of subscribers. You know, there's another explanation for this, because we communicate with a lot of bloggers, I made someone a blogger myself just with my colleagues, yes, and I don't like two things.
So I went in, I was in one blogger chat, there were 50-60 bloggers with half a million channels, and I flew in on my usual wave, oh, what, yes, you are this, I know you, let's do this, let's mess around with these, let's do this with these, then I write, I have 100 thousand dollars extra, I need to advertise, because I don't remember what VPN or cashback is, what is VPN, I think, and I say, oh, she has VPN, this and that. Or the second example, we tell the guy, and we have a lot of advertisers, but we have certain formats bought out for years in advance, sweaters, for example, with a brand are bought out, I fly into another channel, well, to another channel owner, I say, take this exchanger there, a proven exchanger, we will speed up right away, well, so that we don’t fuck up there, he threw in, yes, we will speed up, I say, check for years, type in how much your advertising costs, he says 5, and what is there to advertise, I say, well, this is crypto, oh, no, crypto 10, go to hell with you, and most of the bloggers, even there are 3-5 times bigger than me, they have occupied a comfortable niche for themselves with earnings of 3-5 thousand dollars a month, yes, they don’t need anything else.
Speaker 1:
No, well, how, they advertise, there are different rates and so on, well, Instagram, at least bloggers, I don’t know about YouTubers there.
Sergey:
Well, YouTube less often, of course, but I mean, they are in their comfort zone, you know, and even if you offer him, dude, you can earn a million there, just do what we do, he will say, no, why the fuck, I say, take 100 thousand, you just do advertising, you are like my proven product, I am in your community, I am responsible for it, this is for me, no way, and laziness, laziness, comfort zone and that’s it. And this, probably, it seems to me, is the main problem, but I can’t, because I still have a fidget in my ass.
And I’m still not a blogger, I am an entrepreneur first and foremost, you know, I think about how to make money.
Speaker 1:
I understand.
"Is carding alive!?"
Speaker 2:
If we take the topic of money, as we started, we discussed different topics in our previous podcasts, so what is your message here now? Grow, as you, as Dima said, a brand, then gather an audience, then try to develop products that, oh, you use yourself, that is, it should not be crap. It should be something, if you use it yourself, then a priori it is no longer crap. And with the help of this, monetize and increase your income, that is, monetize your audience and brand.
Okay, that's now, but if we dive a little back into your past. You know, there is an opinion on the Internet that there are still all sorts of gray topics, murky topics on the Internet, how to make money. Young people watch, dream, remember some of those old ones. As a person with experience, what can you say, should they look in this direction or try to keep up with the times, develop? Is this topic dead or not? How does carding even exist?
Sergey:
Carding is alive, of course, and hacking and ransomware are still alive, but I wouldn't advise it, because you need to start from the chance that you'll be jailed or not. Let's say that many computer crimes happen there and remain so forever, because the victims prefer not to report. And there is an opinion that the percentage of solved and generally known computer crimes, I may be wrong, does not exceed 30%.
That is, your chance of going to jail is 30%, but I would evaluate it differently, I would say that your chance of going to jail is 50%, that is, you either go to jail or not, that is, you do not have a firm guarantee that you will be in the 70% of lucky ones, you see, with my luck, I will definitely be in the 30 idiots who will go to jail and for a long time, that's why I would not advise
getting into this, firstly, secondly, computer forensics, so to speak, I talked to different levels, from different, that is, countries and so on, they have learned to deal with this very well, that's the second point. Well, and the third, we all started this in the 90s, we did not have such opportunities. Now I have a guy who is involved in YouTube, he earns a thousand and something dollars at 19, maybe already at 2 thousand, I don't know.
We have a boy from Uzbekistan, an agent, he sells us advertising, helps, we can't cover everything there ourselves. He's basically just our salesman, he's on a percentage, there were months when he earned 5 thousand dollars, and he's still 17, he's going to college at 20, that's it. That is, there's a ton of work on the Internet, freelancing is full of idiots, even if you write text normally, a copywriter, you can easily replace him.
So there's no point in going into crime now.
About carder gatherings
Speaker 2:
Listen, could we have done it earlier, you say earlier, that is, in the 90s, as I understand it, when all this was starting, there were just some legends, they still are. You know, like now about the arbitrageur, these cars, cars, girls, drugs, that's how carders used to live, that is, these were some closed gatherings where guys would come, they all knew each other, they were encrypted, and they just had a ton of money there, everything was rushing. Was it like that or not? Here you are as a witness of those events.
Sergey:
Well, yes, it was. I didn't really participate in any of those big gatherings, but we were constantly, anyway, you're on the Internet there, well, you're surrounded by all sorts of VPNs, well, that wasn't developed back then, in vain, by the way, fewer people would have been in jail, including me, although I would have been in jail anyway, because I'm a moron. We would constantly visit each other in different countries, because that way you're kind of encrypted on the Internet, but you still have a close circle with whom you constantly work.
Well, and there is already a certain trust, because you have been working for years. We went, we know that Vasya lives in Spain, for example, or in Odessa. We got down to it and got ready to go to him. He, as a rule, paid for everything, naturally, without excesses, so that the person would not strain himself and could pay himself, but somehow we had such an order in our community that the host paid, then they would come to me, I would pay for everything.
There were parties, and this is probably the only moment that I miss from the past, namely from my previous work, so to speak.
Speaker 2:
So they were worth it, it turns out, precisely in such a pleasant moment.
Sergey:
Well, you know what else? It's also just nostalgia for youth. The thing is that now, if you compare our parties that were in the early 2000s with the parties that are held by urbitrageurs, casino people and so on now, and even by some bonus hunters, yes, it's incomparable. Our pale shadow was.
Speaker 1:
Well, by the way, this is very funny, because I watch some conferences there, AVA, Sigma and something else, but Interpol can just come there and just rake everyone in as a guarantor, and I'm very interested in why this doesn't happen. Either there's some kind of lull, or society and the world in general have become uninterested in this, so much has all this become the norm, I don't know, what do you think?
Laundering money through crypto
Sergey:
The money is simply not the same. I can say what interests American law enforcement the most, they are interested in Ransomware, that is, who blocks their corporations, extorts money, including hospitals and so on, yes, and this gas pipeline of theirs, this pipeline was blocked, there is the DarkSide group, it was such a loud one, well, and they are most interested in money laundering, that is, money laundering, naturally, all goes through crypto, therefore, cryptocurrencies, exchange owners, mixer owners especially, Someone was jailed there recently, I don’t remember.
Well, Tornado Cash there, yes. In short, they will be jailed and further persecuted. And even, for example, Bitzlata was an office, yes, figuratively speaking, they started as just a bulletin board, like there you sell crypto, you buy, and that’s it. Then they started taking a percentage of it. That is, they just advertise and advertise. You paid a dollar for it, for example. And then they started taking a percentage. And it backfired on them, because they became a party to the deal unwittingly.
You exchanged dirty money with him, with extortion, with drugs. American cops found out about it. And where else did 10% of the deal go? Here. So, they are kind of involuntary, yes, an accomplice to this deal, although they did not know. And, accordingly, they were brought to criminal responsibility. So, with Vlad and my partner, we made a kind of change, meaning a rating, well, monitoring of exchangers, yes.
And we take this into account, we wouldn't know, but American lawyers told us, my Lithuanian, he told us, he said, look, there was such a scheme, and that's why we only take the onus from them. That is, we don't receive, we receive zero impulses, you understand? Dividends, not shares. Yes, in general, yes. And this is an important point, by the way. And so after my prison terms and so on, I prefer to move, well, just purely in white, everything according to the law, to minimize the chance of me being thrown out again.
Consequences of breaking the law before the United States
Speaker 2:
Well, you see, look, it turns out that the main underlying factor is the American government, American citizens, the American security system, let's call it that, and you, as far as I remember, even had a problem that after your prison terms, two prison terms, and you were resolving the issue with America for quite a long time, even after you finished, that is, you got out.
Sergey:
From the fourth to the twenty-third, I spent nineteen years deciding.
Speaker 2:
So you did your time, you answered for all your actions, and then you spent another 20 years trying to prove that you did your time, guys, I'm already white, I've become white.
Sergey:
But America uses the law of the strong, and by doing so, you know, what's important in justice is not to punish a specific person, but to show others an example that, don't do that.
Speaker 1:
Case law.
Sergey:
Yes, because they're not interested in one person, they're interested in, well, case law is almost about that, they're interested in scaring off 100 potential criminals, they could forgive that one. But they use his example to discourage 100. And that's why they show, my example is not the brightest, for example, the director was Charles Polanski, he was arrested in Switzerland 30 years later for some rape
in the 70s in the USA, and they arrest anyone 10-30 years later and demonstratively give some tough terms or not tough ones to someone, but they show that you can't get away from us. That's why the most savvy carders, for example, those who are still hammering something there in some kind of fraudulent ways, they know this and try, well, you don't need to hammer America, you can hammer Europe, there, I don't know, some CIS or other, Nigeria figuratively there, although Nigeria itself can hammer, and there Brazil and something else, but it's better not to touch America, I realized long ago that it's better not to touch America.
Speaker 1:
Well, by the way, arbitrageurs also don't like to pour America for the same reasons, because there may be some tough lands there.
Sergey:
It doesn't forgive at all.
How to drain carved-out funds
Speaker 1:
Yes, it does not forgive, but Europe, Europe forgives everything. They all pour Europe, and there is something else there. Look, it was also interesting to talk to us, since the audience is mainly, who are there, Internet marketers, various mobile app developers, perhaps our Internet mouser friends. And what is the turnover of this kind of money that we are talking about, which is drained through Facebook, Google and so on, advertising networks, because, as far as I know, this is now one of the largest gateways there.
Sergey:
I don’t know, to be honest, I’m far from it, but the first bills can be attributed to this, probably, yes, when you just make an account, link a virtual card to it and then just throw it away. But it’s hard to unscrew the first bills now, it doesn’t work, they have inserted too many technical methods there. There was a funny case. In short, the guy connected, well, he made the first YouTube account, connected a card there, and some bug happened on YouTube.
And he has a channel about games, about tanks or something, in short, some channel, and he managed to write there from Navareg, there were thousands, in short, 160 or whatever dollars. He got 1,500 subscribers on his channel, his ads and videos just ran out, and there was no money there at all, as if that couldn't happen. It happens, but these are bright cases and that's all. Write yourself who is pouring, how much you drain per day from the card.
Speaker 2:
From the original account.
Sergey:
Yes, and the IP there, don't forget to leave your personal one.
Data theft via Wi-Fi
Speaker 2:
By the way, about IP addresses, leave them there and about carding, if you take. Let's take our VPN products there, yes, for example. There are many people there, like, why do you need a VPN there? We've discussed it many times already. But, in principle, carding is also related to it. That is, if, roughly speaking, people are still a little surprised by their idiocy. They go to a cafe, connect to Macs, to public Wi-Fi, chase, the data is not encrypted, but that's half the trouble. That is, before it was over HTTP, but now you can, for example, come, it's still a working topic, it's been there for 20 years. You can come to an establishment, turn it on.
Sergey:
Create an access point, Wi-Fi and sniff all the cards, all the traffic.
Benefits of using a VPN
Speaker 2:
Call McDonald's, they'll hook you up in a shopping center. You'll have absolutely all the data. Cards, banks, cuckoos, access anywhere. Well, that's it, welcome. Then you find, we won't name it, this whole movement still exists. You go, sell it or make it yourself, if you're a fool. And off you go. But the people there, they're greedy. That is, they need to buy our VPN, not our VPN, it doesn't matter, our good one, for $5, for $10 a month, and that's it, connect anywhere.
You connect, your data won't be at the expense of a thousand percent.
Sergey:
But people don't know this first of all, that VPN encrypts traffic, you know? They don't know, and if it's also in some PM with TLS, then it's even better.
Speaker 2:
Yes, it's hard to get there.
Sergey:
And the question is, well, what does VPN give you? Firstly, access to resources blocked in your country, secondly, it encrypts your traffic. And the fact that it encrypts traffic, that I'll connect to some public Wi-Fi, that's half the trouble. But if I'm involved in crime, like I had this in my case personally, that is, the cops established, the Belarusian ones, they established who my operator was, my home Internet provider, Beltelecom, and that's it, they just knew my home address, where I live, they traced it to the apartment, it was a rented apartment, and they installed a sniffer on Beltelecom, I don't remember what that program was called.
And then they simply analyzed all my traffic according to the layout. Either it's mail or correspondence. It turns out that there's a key logger there. That is, all my logins, passwords, etc. Everything is in the open, not encrypted. That is, if I had a VPN at that time, they were just starting out. The fourth, fifth, sixth year. Then it would have gotten to them with a key length of 256 bits.
It's much more difficult. They would have spent 10 years encrypting it. That's why people just don't know.
Speaker 2:
Well, you see, it turns out to be a two-sided model, that is, they don't know RAS, they don't use it there to access TOR, the same. That is, VPN is not a guarantee that you are not being monitored at all. It's just that you create a tunnel, conditionally, you create an extra layer of security for yourself. But in a public access point, we heard you, don't connect without a VPN. It's just crazy. You are the easiest victim, you provide everything yourself. And then there are many layers of security.
Cashing out stolen money
Speaker 2:
Now, if we take karting, for example, then here's the story. They still work, this is a live topic, phishing sites that are substituted. DNS are substituted, you create 10 sites, say, Privatbank, Monobank, they are all substituted. And that's what Dima initially asked about carding, about arbitrage. There are rumors that many of the guys in the market were guilty of this in order to increase their profitability.
And here's the story. Previously, these cards had to be found by people, they physically went somewhere, bought something. With the Internet era, this whole thing has changed a lot. That is, you could previously put cards in Google, Facebook. It was spinning, filming, only.
Sergey:
Well, this is the second wave of carders. We put this in online stores, just in the simplest way.
Speaker 1:
I know many hotels on Booking, entire hotels exist without real clients.
Sergey:
Yes, even virtual hotels.
Speaker 2:
So there is a super strange scheme, an old one, I don't know how viable it is, about mobile applications. There was a popular thing in Asia, they rolled out an application, some kind of, it doesn't matter which one, I don't know, a flashlight, yes, let's take a calculator, they created subscriptions in it. And then there was a pool of cards, and these cards, Apple IDs were created for them, and Apple didn't ask for a code before. And that's it, from these cards a subscription to their own applications or a one-time purchase was issued.
How Sergey was scammed
Sergey:
Two years ago I replaced my Qiwi card, well it doesn't matter, just a bank card, yes, I received it in an envelope, I linked it to Booking, but decided not to buy from it, went to Sochi with it, only I have the envelope, it's always in my pocket, I come to the restaurant to pay, there were 1050 rubles, I come, and they tell me, zero, I think, how so, in short, well it turns out, I still don't know how it went, to whom and where, yes, I think that Qiwi themselves sinned somewhere, that's because I didn't even pay with it in Booking, I linked it.
But they entered it into games in Google Play Market. And they also entered it, I have 46 thousand rubles, but there were a lot of transactions. About 100 transactions, probably 46 thousand rubles there. And they entered two more times a thousand rubles on some site. I wrote to the website, they immediately returned my money. And Google said, no fucking way, clean transactions, that's it, and they refused.
And I had to do it through the bank, a chargeback.
Speaker 2:
Yes, this is a very strange story. That is, we have a banal life situation on small numbers, but it is viable. If, for example, you have your card. You have a wife. The wife took your card, linked it to some subscription in Apple or Google, it doesn't matter. You will see that you have a charge from Apple or Google. You will go to your subscriptions, you will see, you have no subscription. And you do not understand who is charging you. But she does this all the time.
Speaker 1:
By the way, this is a whole niche of children's applications, mainly, it exists in subscriptions for what children take and buy a lot of things from their parents' phones, uncontrollably.
Sergey:
But is Apple fighting or not?
Speaker 1:
They get a percentage.
"Prison is an expensive pleasure"
Sergey:
Now, when Qiwi burst, I lost 9000 rubles, at the time of closing I had, well, okay. Well, it's bearable. But here's what's funny to you, I was released in 2016, I earned a million two hundred dollars from all my money during this criminal career, but prison is an expensive business, lawyers are for a mobile phone, so that I can have normal food, without excesses.
Prison is a very expensive pleasure, to sit in prison normally, it depends on the prison and so on, 2-3 thousand dollars 2-3 thousand dollars a year, not per year, but per month. Well, it's like in a hotel in Egypt. Yes, or in the budget Maldives. The Maldives have become cheap now. And it turns out that I came to Moscow in 2016, I had 30 thousand dollars left in my pocket.
From this limit, right? Yes, even more. And 30k, and it turns out that I even received investments in cashback. This is the only project with which I have investors. Then I sponsor everything myself. And I have 100 thousand dollars in investments, 30 of my own, but Moscow is an expensive city, here and there, and programmers-developers, and everything, and a year goes by, and I have nothing to eat. I had a period in the spring, I remember, I had nothing to eat for two days, well, nothing at all.
That's it, I had to pay for the apartment, for the Internet, but that's it, but there was no money for food. Then it somehow flew in, I met some good guys on my life's path, I even started a channel then, I think, just from subscribers, from referees who just threw me a grand or two for free, there, for living, well, that's it, they just had money, I didn't, well, some kind of sympathy, I thought, the cops, maybe some, you know... - You're already old, right? - The FSB, there, the cops, well, checked, there, made various gaskets, no, I don't think so.
Why didn't you fix the first term?
Speaker 2:
Listen, I was interested in this question, I don’t remember, maybe you answered it somewhere in the video, it turns out that you sat there twice, after the second time your whole story is white, you went into products, into brand development, into yourself, that is, you started going to people, working, let’s say, but why, that is, this is after the second time, why not after the first, where is this failure, what is the difference?
Sergey:
Well, the first time everything went too softly, there is this general regime first, well, not general reinforced, but this is for first-timers, plus a short term, very 2.5 years, only my trials lasted 1.5 years, and then, in order to sit until some kind of replacement with chemistry, I sat for another year, in short, well, such 2.5 years, of which 1.5 years you are in a daze just hanging out there, smoking there and that's it, well, and I did not understand anything, did not draw any conclusions at all, the second time I was in the camps already, and harsh ones, I was in the best zones in the country, where everyone has a back door from a mobile phone three phones, and then I was in almost the reddest, the second reddest zone, and that's it, I have already been there everywhere, I already know such things for myself, what I am capable of both for good and for bad, and I did such self-analysis, I already understood that such a cockerel, like in this zone, well, everything is brutal there, and so, well, at six in the morning the alarm rang the siren you didn't get up at 601 you can already go to the isolation ward but that's all there the beds are laid out on white there he hasn't shaved there like that I wouldn't go naturally and you wouldn't even go and you wouldn't even go because I have a friend now valik hi he lives in Sweden he has a black guy with me some Belarusian but black and his stubble grows very quickly so he shaves in the morning he has black stubble, he goes already in the evening at 16 o'clock from the industrial area, they stop him, they write a report that you are not shaved, he explains, yes I shaved in the morning, he really shaved, it just grows quickly, and so I realized in such zones that I don't want to end up there, I end up there time after time because I do something wrong, I have much more potential and I don't want to engage in pure crime, plus crime is, as a rule, you you go, whoever you are, whatever your qualifications, well, except for swindlers, probably, but you go within the framework of some chosen craft.
Here someone is a burglar, someone is a pickpocket, someone steals cars, someone steals money from cards, but it limits, you understand? It does not limit business, it gives you a bunch of connections, it gives you synergy between your own projects or mine and yours, and so on, and this is much more interesting.
Speaker 2:
The question of fast money, unfortunately.
Sergey:
Fast, but not easy. They say easy money, like crime is easy, no,
Speaker 2:
It is not easy.
Speaker 1:
A 20-year-old kid, hungry, I don’t know, an orphan or someone else, that he needs to do a long day.
Speaker 2:
So Sergey could not explain to himself after the first time what he needed to do.
Sergey:
But I have a theory, because sometimes I consult people who write dissertations. Well, as a rule, in Switzerland, in Britain, someone I know just talks about cybercrime. I have my own theory of why people go into cybercrime, but especially earlier. That is, I associate it with the fact that we had total poverty, sort of, yes.
In families, and brains were barely present, the Soviet technical school was not destroyed, computers appeared, this is the second factor, technical school, brains, and the third factor, the complete absence of moral education completely. My mother often told me there, I remember, in childhood, that stealing is a sin, but she did not say why it is a sin.
Speaker 1:
But you also understand this Soviet hypocrisy, like we are all friends, on the other hand, everything is common, which means everything is mine, he stole work, yes, he steals everything, a screw that he never did in his life, yes, yes, that is, this is like at the state level, everything was done there, we bow to Lenin and then there.
Speaker 2:
In principle, it remained normal at the everyday level, that is, I don’t know, bread, if you work in gastronomy, that you brought bread home, this is normal.
Speaker 1:
I’m telling you, this is general communism, this is everything for everyone according to their needs. He took it home, that’s all.
The Boomerang Law
Sergey:
By the way, there is one very simple measure to avoid doing bad things, I try to apply it constantly now. You also heard 100% in childhood, treat others the way you want. Don't treat others the way you don't want to be treated. It seems like a word, each of us, of you, has heard it 10 times in our lives, but now I apply it to situations where it arises, where I can deceive someone, pay someone extra, and it seems like who knows, this is something, this devil will sit on this shoulder or not, this is how you can do it, in short, but I hop somehow already, well with age, probably, with experience they come after prison.
And you are not so hungry anymore. I learned to switch, and I would like my partner to do something like that to me, no, I would be unpleasant, and that's it, and you let it go, and you move strictly morally.
Speaker 2:
Well, it's the same thing, I used to look at many things from a different perspective, but as you get older, as you have money, you start to look at things kinder in fact, you're like, well, why, what's the difference, why throw it away, why this, it doesn't solve anything, it doesn't make you feel any better, but you're in harmony with yourself and, in principle, I don't know, I used to be so philosophical about it, someone there, well, you can look at laws differently, citizens working in government agencies have an expression, how do they say, if you're not in jail yet, it's not your merit, it's our shortcoming, that's the kind of thing. And now I think, well, guys, why do something like that, look, it's the 21st century, the Internet, offline, online.
Sergey:
But we need to know about this, you see, it's a big problem, that is, we thought, you and I, that all the world's knowledge would flow there via this Internet and so on, and there would be fewer stupid people, and fewer poor people. And there are more stupid people, because it suits their interests.
Speaker 1:
He slips it in.
Sergey:
They watch A4 and that's it, that is, instead of some educational products, earnings and so on, and that's it. It turns out that our dreams, thanks to whom, yes, YouTube and Facebook, went to hell.
Speaker 1:
Well, in fact, maybe they never existed. And regarding the fact that, well, I just do the same, I go there, you know, with the youth, young guys, I communicate, I also philosophize there, damn, so, so, so, but on the other hand, if I look at myself soberly, damn, I think, it’s just, well, I’ve already earned some money, and I don’t have that grip anymore, plus age, I think, fuck it, fuck it to take risks, but it’s another matter when you’re 16-20, your hormonal level is different, these guys just need to know cases, that is, you can’t teach them in any way, it’s just, for example, your case, it’s like a biblical one, that is, you kind of fell for… you were seduced by money, and you kind of paid for it.
And so you tell it on the Internet. And that’s cool, that is, it can really teach them. And if you sit there, you know, I don’t know, in fashionable clothes, expensive ones, in a Lamborghini and say “guys, money can’t buy happiness,” then it looks hypocritical.
Sergey:
In my situation, it’s also a shame that I could have earned more money legally.
Speaker 1:
Well, in your situation, even in all honesty, there aren’t any super millions on carding, i.e. your payment didn’t match your income from it, i.e. there are a bunch of guys, we discussed them behind the scenes, who earned much more and didn’t pay for it in any way, maybe they have a different kind of luck or something else.
Speaker 2:
Is it a shame that they didn’t pay for it?
Speaker 1:
Yes, I feel bad for Seryoga, if he had 50 straps, and he had some buried somewhere, then it would look better somehow.
What kind of "Zen" and "happiness" is there in prison
Sergey:
Yes, 100%. But you see, history has no subjunctive mood, so it was good. I often ask the heroes of my episodes, from Katya, 10-15 years ago, would you change anything, right? And not a single one, even with tough stories, even tougher than me, would say, no, everything is great, I wouldn't change those. Everything is cool.
Sometimes I even miss that state, because in the zone you are caught at a certain time, when you already know, you have gone through all the stages of complaints, you already understand that well, that's it, I've already done everything, nothing depends on me anymore, just sit. Will I be able to get out earlier? Well, okay. It won't work out, but you sit. And that's it. And you relax, you have this Zen, your day becomes normal, you go, sleep, go to the gym, the rain goes away, and you, like a fool, blissfully walk down the street in the rain, yes, and you just relax your brain. And now I can achieve this state only in two cases.
When I'm standing under the shower, I can stand there for an hour, the water drains, I'm kind of dumbfounded, I think, well, by the way, the most insight and the most connections, here are the answers to the questions I couldn't find about business, I have hop, this moment happens. And the second one, when I'm washing the dishes. Here. And in the zone, this state is common, so I even miss it, but this means that I'm just tired of the information noise that surrounds us. Thousands of channels, telegram channels, calls, phone calls.
Speaker 1:
Oh, tell me, by the way, somewhere I heard this opinion that in the life of every person, regardless of the situation, for example, whether he is in the zone or in the Maldives, there is about the same amount of happiness and unhappiness. Well, that is, like just in the zone, you get a kick out of a ray of light, some tastier bread, I don’t know, something else, and there in the Maldives, it all rubs off on you and it’s like it’s gone, and anyway, this
level is always maintained, that’s what your experience is.
Speaker 2:
You just had different stages, by which you can make a good, interesting selection.
Sergey:
Well, Solzhenitsyn noticed this in “The Zone”, I even stole his quote for my book, the book, by the way, is called “How I Stole a Million”, by the way, it’s a great book, I recommend it to everyone, everyone.
Speaker 2:
Thank you, I recommend reading it.
Sergey:
There he writes, and I, accordingly, that, he says, in the zone, like, all these feelings, they are hypertrophied, that is, and a carrot stub that you managed to get somewhere or a whole one, yes, it evokes more pleasant emotions there than, I don’t know, a Lamborghini there that your second father gave you for your birthday, well, and I felt it on myself, because I had something to compare it with,
when in the carding times, my mother and I were cleaning the house, what did I have, well, when I was already living separately, when I was carding, and she finds some kind of package, well, this one in appearance, there, a tissue package, but square, she says that this, I say, is fucking awesome, she says, if it’s money, half of it is mine, there, I say, well, screw it, like, well, that’s it, in short, well, it was money, it was, I don’t know, in the area, there, maybe 6, maybe 10 thousand dollars, well, fuck, in short, I added 500 dollars to her.
Vitalik laughed like that once, I found 7 thousand euros in the car. Well, I did the same. Plus or minus comparable money. Well, I was happy, well, look how you and I amazed him, oh, great, everything is there. And that's it, well, when in the zone I found, in short, a kilogram of these truffle pyramid candies, yes. Where did you find them? In my bag. Well, I just forgot that they were there. And a kilogram of these candies, and packs, probably 4 Liptons in pyramids, there are all sorts of forest herbs, well, like forest berries, what the hell for tea is this.
I was happy, well, much brighter, more, and more, yes, than these 6 thousand dollars, yes. Because, well, the measure of things simply changes and that's it. Well, and then it rolls back again, here already, well...
Speaker 2:
Well, you're a human being, you get used to everything, you know. You seem to be smart at the moment, but then it all dulls. A little experience remains, but it moves on.
Sergey:
So don't get involved in crime at all, you'll regret it later. So I was lucky, you know, that there, well, my parents are alive there, this and that. That is, someone ends up in the zone, with someone the wife immediately divorces from the first days, the mother dies, the father refuses, well, there are different, yes, brothers and sisters do not talk to you, because you're a moron, and not a respectable family.
And that's all, therefore, and under such circumstances you can generally go nuts.
Speaker 2:
No, yes, guys, of course, that is, we are discussing different ways to make money online, but anything that crosses the line of the law, we strongly advise against, let's call it that.
Speaker 1:
Yes, there are some internal relationships with corporations, for example, in our mobile applications you can violate guidelines somewhere and, for example, Apple or Google can ban you, but nevertheless you do not violate the law in any way, these are your internal business dealings with this corporation. Another thing is to go to someone and actually steal something, because, for example, carding or something like that, it is no different from stealing a person's wallet, for example.
Speaker 2:
Or crypto call centers are also there. I just hate them.
Stories about call centers
Speaker 1:
By the way, in your opinion, we just have a wild number of these callers in Ukraine. Dnepr, Evhark. Yes, yes, yes, it's just such a horror, such, well, such a dogradaniya of society. And on the other hand, young people really have nowhere to go. For example, I have a younger sister there, she has a bunch of friends there who are trying to find a normal job. And from the jobs, they are a crypto caller, onlyfans, maybe some arbitrage, farmer. This is already like a high-level in comparison with this.
Speaker 2:
They are still two-sided.
Speaker 1:
Yes, and this is also no better, in fact.
Sergey:
This story surprises me. Sometimes they call me too. One called under the garbage, mowed down. I generally react nervously when the authorities call me, because they call me, because they call me, it happens. Well, and then I think, again these five, well, at one moment, or scammers. Then I look, he says, Sergei Pavlovich is there, I think, well, it's clear, there will be a goose. He's teasing me from some investigator. And I listened and listened, turned on the dictaphone, I still have people sitting, we are sitting in my office.
There was someone who came to film, Vlad was sitting there, and I was here in the middle. I was telling him, and then I got fed up, it was already recorded, I said, listen, go to hell. He said, what, are you an employee? I said, what kind of employee are you? If you were an employee, you would know that I am not Pavlovich, but Aleksandrovich, and Pavlovich is just my last name, in short, that's it. But in general, to be honest, I am very surprised at how stupid people are in general, well, on Earth, yes. There is an article on LURK that says, LURK is blocked, well, guys, get a VPN, buy it and go to LURK, LURK more.
Speaker 1:
Better partner with us at forestall.Com, buy our motivated traffic, set up your own application and don't know any grief.
Sergey:
Yes. And there was such a funny article written in their style, that 95% of people are idiots all over the world, well, in general, from the whole planet. I don’t agree about 95, I think it’s still somewhere around 80 probably. Well, really, yes, idiots. And in this regard, I’m surprised at what these callers are up to. Just honestly, that….
Speaker 1:
Just what a volume of this, even I have some acquaintances there from the media bank, who are somehow connected, there, they pour traffic or something else into these things, they just come, for example, there’s an affiliate world conference, and these people have a million stands there, and they show them straight diagrams of market growth, like some kind of venture business.
In Finland, we have 100 million suckers, you can screw so many more.
Speaker 2:
There was such a funny movie with Steadham “The Beekeeper”. Bad movie, so-so awful, but the funny thing is that Hollywood is making a movie about crypto-code centers, a movie with Steadham, it's a bit childish.
Speaker 1:
So how much jam did we have there, the whole city was just abandoned, that is, the volume of it is just so incredible.
Speaker 2:
Wait, I'll give you a spoiler. Do you know who ended up owning the crypto call center in the movie with Steadham? The son of the US president. At the end of this whole chain was the son of the US president.
Sergey:
Neither Gram nor Biden.
Speaker 1:
Hunter Biden. - Some dude told me that he was in Interpol, because he was pouring traffic into this thing and through their traffic they screwed some senator in the US for half a billion bucks. And another guy also told me that he worked somewhere in an Israeli call center, and at the next table the guy fucked over the Prince of Dubai, and they spent a week drinking. Because they are their enemies, you understand?
In short, there are stories like that.
Sergey:
Well, of course, they are curious about what they were up to, right? Well, what was it before the war? In short, there was a channel in Telegram, I don’t know if it’s still there or not, it’s an office thing, we’re friends there, well, those Ukrainians who work in call centers, well, the top ones there, let’s say. In short, they leaked, they record everything, and the funniest cases, the wildest cases, they leaked to this channel. It was there privately, everything. And there it was before the war, well now it’s clear that, yes, arson of military registration and enlistment offices, there, pouring green paint in polling stations, there, somehow throwing a Molotov cocktail at the prosecutor’s house or throwing a Molotov cocktail and so on.
But before the war they just leaked, you look, it seems, and what’s there, both old and young, you look, well, mostly women were stupid, of course. By the way, I practically never saw men, no offense to women, but that’s how it happened. The girl there is 18 years old, let's say, well, not 18, 20 years old, really young. Or there is an aunt there, 40, 50 years old even, already a granny.
They, imagine, force them there, well, maybe it was you who called from Ukraine, I don't know. But they force them, that is, she comes up, they tell her to take biometrics, to undress. She stands up completely, spreads her arms, becomes like this Vitruyan man, they film, they say, now we can't film, come closer to the camera, turn your back, bend over, and that's it, and so on, and I think, my God, how do they do this, isn't this a fake?
Speaker 2:
You understand that they are still driving, that is, they have already done the work, of this word, please, step.
Speaker 1:
Another guy told me that he worked with them somewhere, and in this call center, the head there, well, usually it's a Jewish topic, the head was Jewish, and their top sales manager was his seven-year-old son. He taught, like, how to make money from an early age. It's just that when I was doing media buying, there were a million temptations to somehow upload traffic there or something like that, but for me it's just complete moral madness.
It's just the ultimate scam and people really commit suicide. It's not like, you know, ripping someone off for $50, it's people selling apartments right there, and then they call them, their relatives, and tell them.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, I think exactly the same, absolutely, considering. Well, to be fair, there's money, of course they just pressure you with money there. Well, because there's just money there. That is, you just take it. If we take the same card that's there. That is, there is no cost. There is no spender, they just transfer cryptocurrency over the phone. You just understand, in your card, as it was, you could empty the card, yes, but conditionally many cards were insured even if a case of fraud was discovered later.
Sergey:
Well, yes, some from a dolam, in my opinion, is not desirable.
Speaker 2:
And here's the story, that is, they can screw someone, this someone is with him, if he transferred the money himself, that's the whole point of it all. If a person transferred the money himself, it's not an insurance case. If it's not a virus, they didn't know anything. Well, that's it, and the person there, a pensioner or a young man, loses all his money absolutely.
Which banks are better?
Sergey:
Because you confirmed it via FaceID. Well, what's the beauty of American banks? Our applications, let's say, Ukrainian banking ones, they are the best in the world objectively. I have 10 European state banks there, there are several, well, these neobanks, Revolut, Vice, I have all this, and I can compare. The American ones are very bad, yes, it’s about the same level as Thailand, you have to come for every reason, I forgot to reissue my card, come, I came, I say, reissue me a card, I came with my passport, they say, where is your checkbook, I need it, I have a passport, yes, a phone, which is here, call me, here I have a passport, a phone, no, bring the checkbook, I went, stood there for two hours, then the American banks are about the same system, but at the same time all ours do not return your money to you in case of fraud or something else, and the American ones do, they are bad, but they are reliable, well, except for individual cases when they go bankrupt, like Silicon Will Bank there, but nevertheless, this is a big difference, and therefore, as if, on the one hand, I have no particular reason to love the Americans, yes, on the other hand, I have respect for them, respect of what kind, that they all after all, well, they care a little about their own citizens, their own, they don't give a damn about others. That is, look, if someone arrests a Russian in any country, they immediately start fussing about, well, not a Russian, but, I mean, an American, they immediately try to help, pull him out and so on. They
don't abandon their own, as they say.
Speaker 2:
By the way, it's the opposite with Russians, some famous Russians, that is, Russians say, they don't abandon their own, but... No, well, yes. Many are still resting.
"Lord of War"
Sergey:
Yes, but now it's only concern that they pulled the masses so widely because of Krasikov, "Lord of War" was filmed based on his motives.
Speaker 1:
I didn't know that this would happen yet, I watched it, yes, I also watched a cool film about it, how is the actor there, I don't forget Nicholas Cage, yes, and now he's somehow become an alcoholic.
Sergey:
How is he, he, he is a criminal, he is Francis Ford Coppola's nephew, Sofia Coppola is his cousin, he doesn't care, but that's not how I found out either, I just saw that he was drinking all the time and now he always has shitty films there. That's why, firstly, they don't abandon their own, and secondly, they really act tough and are edifying to the whole world, showing that don't bother us, we will get you at any time, even in 20-30 years.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, you see, even internet scammers, former scammers, if everyone knows unspoken, don't touch America. Reputation speaks for itself, so to speak.
Sergey:
Well, plus they forgave me, that's the third reason, respect and love, well, how did they forgive me, well, they admitted that it's an absurd situation, let's close Pavlovich's case, thank God, and that same prosecutor just closed a case against another person who's very important to me, I'm already thinking about it, in short, his name is Orlando, I'm already thinking about slapping something here, Orlando, the American flag, because I have American Express on my shoulder, like, the American Express emblem, yeah, and now Orlando will be here, yeah, the sheriff will pick him up,
Let's sum it up.
Speaker 1:
What can we sum it up, guys? I realized from our conversation that there's no point in doing dirty work, there are more minuses than pluses.
Sergey:
Possible minuses.
Speaker 1:
Well, possible, of course, yes, until we do it. What can you do? You can come to Sergey, if you are a blogger, in the cashback service for an affiliate, take a coupon, share with him a referral for the services he makes, just watch his cool content, use his VPN, download, pre-order vodka, a book, buy a book if you haven't bought it.
Socks, well, the whole set. You can come to us for an affiliate for organic mobile applications, buy motivated traffic in Foros.Com, buy the WebView application App4Rent.Com, pour it into our application Traffic4.Partners, watch our YouTube channel and subscribe to all channels and go to our closed community of mobile developers and affiliate marketers in Telegram.
There will be a link here.
Sergey:
And also go to Google, in short, and simply enter the name of your company in the search bar. For partners. It would be super. And light apps, and that's it. To cheat behavioral.
Speaker 1:
And the books of Sergey Pavlovich, which do not need advertising.
Sergey:
Cheating PF. By the way, it's strange, it still works in Yandex. He does nothing about it, he doesn't care. It doesn't work in Google, they can't bypass all sorts of protections there. But in Yandex he made a bot farm, he collected cookies. That's it, please, that's it.
Speaker 2:
If I give a short summary, that is, what's the story. There is money on the Internet, if you are a blogger, you just don't know what to do, how to make money, come to Sergey, Sergey simply tells you turnkey, you can here, here, here, here, study and you will have millions. If you work with apps or with traffic, damn, we already have so many services, just come to us, write to Dima, write to me.
Speaker 1:
More services than non-services.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, you just say, guys, I'm a marketer, okay, you come to our affiliate program then. You say, guys, I'm a developer, okay, you come to us to partner with for motivated traffic.
Speaker 1:
I want to work, you come to us or to Sergey to work. We just give you everything, the main thing is not to card and deceive people.
Speaker 2:
Less black stuff, a lot of white stuff, welcome. A lot of white stuff, that's good. Yeah, yeah. Well, thank you.
