CARDER IN AMERICAN PRISON: Uncensored and unedited

[Cloned Boy]

In this thread, famous carder Sergey Pavlovich continues his conversation with Vladislav Khorokhorin, better known as cybercriminal and carder BadB. We talk about his extradition from France to America and what happened to him in US prisons. Also, who are jail niggas and what do prisoners do in American captivity.

Sergey Pavlovich continues to troll Vladik BadB on the topic of blacks in American prisons, guards, being locked up in a mental hospital, judicial errors, prison uniforms, American prisoners, cell phones behind bars, we also talk about famous Russian and American hackers, what terms they got and for what, how carders are identified, how much a cell phone costs behind bars in the USA, about working in American prisons, how to get a shorter term and much more.

Enjoy reading!

Contents:

• The Americans' main claim against you? 3 billion dollars?
• Catching criminals is a business for Americans
• How to Trick American Wardens with a Magnet
• On a private jet to a mental hospital
• About the charge: how many years did you face? US criminal procedure system.
• How much did you earn and how much of it did you save?
• What are you doing now?
• How much does it cost to sell a vulnerability?
• Has the term given you the right thoughts?
• How much do you earn now?
• On the American justice system and modern cybercrime
• How Americans Detected a Ukrainian Carder via Jabber
• Who handled your case?
• A miscarriage of justice for 15 years?!
• About the genius carder Max Ray Butler
• How much does a phone cost in the American zone?
• About working in American camps: on a quad bike on the beach?!
• Where were you sitting?
• How much do drugs cost in American prisons?
• Security chicks, sex with a security chick?!
• How and why Konstantin Yaroshenko was framed by the Americans
• About the verdict
• About shackles, handcuffs, the color of the robe
• How much did you pay the lawyer, what would have happened if you had no money?

The Americans' main complaint against you? $3 billion?
Pavlovich:
What was the Americans' main complaint against you? Selling dumps?

Carder:
Selling dumps.

Pavlovich:
Dumps are, if anyone doesn't know, information on the magnetic strip of a credit card, which is contained. Well, any bank card.

Carder:
I think some people don't know, some don't look. Yes, in fact, it was an aggravated felony, that is, a felony is... It is not translated, that is, it is a serious crime, yes, serious. But, let's say, it is not murder. Felony is a white collar crime, that is, from a white collar. That is, it can be fraud, theft, something like that, yes. That is, it can be called a felony.
What changed was wire fraud, that is, dumps, and even in the indictment it appears that, in my opinion, the external budget, in my opinion, either Liberia or something shorter, is less than the figure by which the United States was robbed, that is, there they counted for me something around 3-3 billion dollars, but they just come to this figure in a very, very interesting way, they take before calculating the damage according to the damage account,
yes, they take the number of dumps that they found on your computer, I had them there, well, more than five million, yes, and they simply multiply, in my opinion, by 250 dollars, yes, well, it is clear that the figure is simply astronomical.

Pavlovich:
I want to say, they are still counting you a little. Do you know why? I saw when I read the book about Max Ray Butler, yes, an outstanding carder, I wrote about him in my book, they count, yes, they really take some average arithmetic, well, 200 there to 300 dollars, let's not say exactly up to 300 dollars, when the Belarusians counted together with the American authorities, my damage, you know what they did, they also found all the cards on my computer, they looked at how much was actually stolen from them, and I want to tell you, I simply divided this amount, yes, I had a more modest one by 36 million dollars, I divided it by the number of these cards in total and I got that, just the average arithmetic, we all understand that on one card there can be a million greenbacks by 1 0, the average arithmetic for me was 1250 dollars, so in your case they counted more or less humanely, that is, 300 dollars and 1250, well, you see four times more.

Catching criminals is a business for Americans.
Carder:
In fact, it's probably better to explain it, of course, Bukh, but I'll explain it all in business, that is, for Americans it's not like for ours, yes, for ours it's also business, yes, but for us, the higher he is, let's say, the trash has sorted out, the more stripes he has, yes, and the more bribes he can grab and can get money from people. But for Americans, it's business in a different way.
For them, they work, they have good salaries actually, but the trash there gets 80-100 thousand dollars a year, that is, somewhere around ten thousand dollars a month, at least.

Pavlovich:
Well, plus a good social package.

Carder:
Social package, teeth, everything, that is, insurance also costs, you have to understand 20 thousand dollars. Teeth, family, car, leasing, house. All this also costs good money. Prison trash gets less. Prison trash gets a screw 1060, 50-60. But usually such morons get jobs there, who would be called after the army. In principle, they are such good people.
They are called rednecks, hillbillies.

Pavlovich:
Like Texans, the collective farm belt of the USA, the rural belt of the USA, rednecks.

Carder:
Yeah, but these people are like that, they come especially after the army, they say I'm a hero, here and there, but they don't want to work. And this is the kind of work, well, in fact, there is work for the recumbent, they come in such morons, they sit all day playing on the computer, playing solitaire, something else.
He has to get up, there is no lazier person in the world than an American, he has to get up and do something, I don’t know at all, but it’s unrealistic, it just has to be, they have to have an order under the order, the only thing is they do it well, that is, if he is supposed to do it, he will do it, he will not forget about it, although there are such unique individuals who forget about it, but in general, they basically cope with their immediate duties, well, like if it is written in the job description, they will do it well, but they do not do it well, they do it as much as it is written, and usually it is written well.
And therefore, the system itself, this is the vulnerability of their system, in that each official, and all this, well, this is public data, that is, everything, each instruction is written down, for example, well, let's jump right away, yes, I simply organized black terror for them, they found a pipe, they found a phone, they simply caught me with the phone. It was right in my light bulb. Was this in a pretrial detention center? No, not in a pretrial detention center, this is already in prison. That is, I was in prison and in my light bulb, well, I screwed on a charger, took off the light bulb, inserted the phone there, it charged.
Someone turned me in. I had a long time, probably 4 months, and in general, someone turned me in.

How to deceive American guards with a magnet.
Carder:
I also came up with a very interesting topic. I don’t know, if someone is sitting, I don’t know if we use this or not, I attached a magnet to a pipe, to the phone itself, yes, and it turns out that it was magnetized to any iron surface, that is, the trash goes so much, well, they are fat-assed, such fat Indians, and it turns out that there is, for example, such a chair, and everything iron in the prison, that is, there is practically nothing non-iron there, and I constantly, for example, they went to look, they didn’t want to find my phone, I just magnetized it to the chair, and it is such a fat creature, he can’t bend down there under it and well, and he can’t stick his hand in there, but it turns out that the phone is right here in plain sight, you just need to lower your head and you can see it, that is, I’m lying on the bed and it is magnetized right under the chair, I can see it, and the trash walks around, he searches the whole hut, turns it inside out, opens the ventilation, and the phone is there, and they missed it many times, in the end someone and the charger is just there are no sockets, the charger was in the light bulb and they opened the light bulb, found the phone charger, well, I'm in the house, so they take me to the lieutenant, he says everything is on fire,
I caught you, I say listen, you can't even imagine this, he says that you know, you have I have a huge pain in my ass right now, seriously, a pain in my ass, a pain in my ass, you could say, a pain in my ass. He says, what do you mean? I say that I want to commit suicide.
I say, listen, as soon as you lock me up now, I'll find you, cut everything up, in short, I'll just hang myself and that's it, I'll hang myself, that's all I want to do, smash my head against the bed, wherever you lock me, and when people say that, they have clear instructions, that is, I read it all on the computer, how they should act, what their deadlines are, and then the following situation happens, they have to specially place me in a medical isolation ward under observation, specially by a guard.

Pavlovich:
Well, and maybe undress me in a felt room.

Carder:
Well, they didn't have a felt room there. They had a regular room with plexiglass. A guard sits behind the plexiglass. They give me this half-robe. Well, one that can't be torn. Like a straitjacket? Like a straitjacket. Well, like this. Probably just below the ass. And it turns out that apart from this and the pillow you have nothing else. The air conditioner is cold, it blows, it's very nasty, unpleasant, but it's twice as unpleasant for the guard.
That is, you have fun, you can run around there, cover, jump. That's where I was already having fun, I just don't want to. I sang songs in Russian, told him off, told him how I don't like America, told him about his wife, about his children.
And he sits behind the glass on the other side and he has to write down just my every word, my every action, that is, I stood up, he writes down my every action with a pen in a notebook, that is, I stood up, orienting, lying in bed, walking fast and he just writes it all down, calls me names, and in addition to this, the most unpleasant thing is, I just noticed how powerless it was for them. I lay down on the bed, it turns out, well, this straitjacket is short, and it turns out that his balls are sticking out into the cell there. And not into the cell, but there towards the window, right? And it turns out that he, here he sits, yes, and here they are my balls, and he has to look at them.
That is, it is clear that this really bothered the guys, they just had a hard time with it. But have you been there after all? Yes, they tried, but the point is that I understood how much time is needed, and while I'm sitting there, they can't arrange a prison trial and take away my good time, that is,
good time, jumping, they can't take it away from me while the lieutenant, they have to bring the lieutenant from the person authorized to judge you and take it away, and they, well, have to arrange a mini-trial, that is, with the presence of witnesses, everything, that is, they have to say, well, that is, they have to do all this according to procedure, and since I can't be subjected to stress, yes, they can't do it.
How many times have they tried to judge me, I immediately climbed onto the bucket, I screamed that I was going to jump from there now, that is, well, they had to leave, in short.

On a private plane to a mental hospital.
Carder:
Well, that is, a psychologist immediately came running, and the most interesting thing is, that is, I sat like that for two weeks, the psychologist kept asking me if I wanted to kill myself and in general what was going on, they, that is, they couldn’t take me on a common bus to the stage, they specially sent me, I swear they specially sent a plane for me and they took me like a rock star on a private plane to another medical prison, that’s where psychologists and psychiatrists have the right, for example, to give you an injection to fry your brains there or, well, to hit you with some kind of tarazin there, well, I’ve seen people on tarazin, they’re just walking zombies, that’s the kind of crap that walks around, and in short, when you see these people, you immediately don’t want to act up anymore, but the very fact that you were taken to a private prison, when they transported me to a prison, they think it’s to another prison, they think it’s none of our business that he was caught with a phone and essentially they can’t do anything to me, that is, I got away with it, but for a phone they take away 3 months right away.

About the charge: how many years did you face? US criminal procedure system.
Pavlovich:
Let's go through this, the procedure, that is, you are charged, now we'll just go to prison, so step by step quickly, so that it is, you are charged with selling dumps, in short, in total there you are talking about 3 or something dollars, yes, damage. Well, yes. And how much did you face for this? 57 or 62 years, there are documents, you can just throw it all off. That is, if you were found guilty on all counts? 62 years.
Well, that is, I will explain in the States, if anyone does not know, there is simply each episode, let's say, each article gives you a certain number of points.

Carder:
No, there is a system there, let me tell you about the procedural system in general. It depends again on how, if you go to a jury trial, then the standard system works, in fact the jury gives you a conclusion, guilty or not guilty, and then the judge determines, let's say, how guilty you are and how much you get for it, yes, this is in a standard form, but if you work, let's say, with the investigation,
provide assistance, then a point system really works, according to which they tell you, let's say, that you did this and that, for this you get plus so many points, and for this you get minus, and then from these points a sum is calculated that determines from what to what term the judge can give you, that is, it is measured in months, it is called guidelines.

Pavlovich:
Well, like this, how does the criminal code turn out in essence.

Carder:
In our case. Not really, because there is a very flexible system and it turns out that, let's say, cooperated with the investigation minus 15 points, but at the same time provided, let's say, created problems for the investigation there, or behaved badly in prison or something like that, that is, all this is added up, and the damage, let's say, yes, that is, I had damages of more than 500 million dollars, yes, that is, this is the greatest damage
that can be, this is immediately plus 40 points to everything, that is, and so it is calculated and then the points, yes it is written, that is, there is a table where it is written from steel to steel points, these are 40 from steel to steel, such a table, but in order to arrive at these points, the system is really very flexible.
That is, the number of victims is taken into account, each of your actions is taken into account, what you did, the total amount of what you did is taken into account, what, for example, you used is taken into account, did you use a weapon, they wrote that I used, because they said that a computer is a weapon and well, in general, there are a lot of such things.

Pavlovich:
Did you try to somehow compensate for the damage, to make amends, if there were victims, for example?

Carder:
Well, what, well, how can you make amends, to compensate?

Pavlovich:
No, I mean in general, that is, not in that case, but when calculating these points, for example.

How much did you earn and how much of it did you keep?
Carder:
Well, that's impossible. To compensate for three billion dollars. If I made 20 million, 30 million dollars on this, then that's good. Well, someone made more, but my figure is somewhere around this.

Pavlovich:
So this 20-30 million, is this the cash that you once had?

Carder:
Which passed through me and which I gave again to the people from whom I bought these dumps for resale.

Pavlovich:
How much of this money did you manage to save?

Carder:
None, I spent it all. Pavlovich: In general, yes? What are you doing now? Carder:

In general, yes. In general, I'm currently working on Upwork and hiring myself out as a programmer there and that's it. Seriously, by the way, well, right now. Plus, I have this Cybersec working for me, yes, I hope that something will work out. As part of our project, we are auditing some specific organizations, increasingly non-American, because we still haven't managed to work out some kind of normal interaction system with the Americans, yes, because so that an insurance company would participate there, so that we would actually be compensated if we find some vulnerability or problems in a company or do some kind of intel and identify that the company is already vulnerable, yes, that is, or even the same databases just sell to companies, yes, this is a dream, but unfortunately, this is well, at the moment, it is impossible that perhaps we work with European companies, companies in the CIS, in principle, the same thing. How much does it cost to sell a vulnerability? Carder: You can simply call our company and say hello, we represent such and such a company, we have not conducted an audit, but we have information that you have had a leak, if you want we will come to your office, and usually companies actually agree to an agreement, only you demonstrate to them something that they really have problems, they pay, that is, a little, there are greedy companies, there are not so, but in general the companies pay well. Pavlovich: So you do pentests, I would say? Carder: Fronttests. When something comes across, then more Europe. Europe is generally interesting. There were several Ukrainian companies. I will not say anything about Russia. Pavlovich: Within the framework of this organization created by Bukh, Klopov, and someone else. Carder: Yes, the organization is actually my idea. It was all created by me and, in principle, Smel. Since the brave one is now on parole, yes, he cannot take part and in principle I am pulling all this, well, I am pulling it so that I can somehow feed myself and earn money and do something, well, as far as this can, let's say if I know that by the way, if you know that there are some systems are vulnerable it is quite possible that I or the people I know can simply call this company and come to an agreement, that is, it is not at all necessary to hack it and everything else. It is quite possible that you can get normal money from this company, simply for the fact that they patch this hole. And this is a normal policy, that is, for example, American companies, they have been organizing such bounties for a long time, that is, really, that is, they give a reward for finding vulnerabilities in their products.
Let's say Microsoft and Apple, by the way, are very greedy in this regard, but Google, for example, pays well for a vulnerability in Chrome, well, recently they paid almost a million dollars.

Pavlovich:
Well, there is this bounty bug, right? Yes, a bounty. Listen, how much money can you get? I know of a vulnerability in one shop, yes, it allows you to completely drain their database, this is an online store, it is the second in its country, the second largest, 70 thousand clients. How much can you ask them for this vulnerability, for example?

Carder:
I can't say off the top of my head, again it all depends on the specifics of the store.

Pavlovich:
It's an online store for electronics, whatever. In what country? Well, it doesn't matter, a small one. It's the second store in the country by size, by number of clients, by volume.

Carder:
Again, if we're talking about a small country, that means that financial information doesn't go through there, it all goes through billing. That is, there's no potential financial information there. What threatens the store is a leak of the customer base. I think they'll pay a few thousand dollars. That is, if you approach them normally and describe the essence of the problem normally, a few thousand dollars. But I don't see a simple option.
I'm not saying that you have to be a black hat guy and commit some kind of crime. To each his own. Everyone decides what to do. I am not against people who go down some black or gray path, but I am simply saying that when the store is really taken off him, take it easy, just take it and sell it to him, find people like mine who will take it and sell it to him, in fact, all of this.
Or give it to him for a review, if you are an altruist. Give it to him for a review, give it to him for the product, you can always find common ground, of course there are dumb people and dumb bosses.

Did the term give you the right thoughts?
Pavlovich:
In his interview with the same Russia 24 he said that I will quote verbatim the term in prison to you, he sent me, corrected me and added the right thoughts.

Carder:
I think that yes, I should have sat and the term in prison corrected me, corrected me and added the right thoughts, what did you mean here?

Pavlovich:
The right thoughts?

Carder:
I think in prison everyone has enough time to think and think very well about the meaning of life and about the meaning of your life and about the meaning of life of all people in general, and you can really experiment with NLP and psychology and you can generally understand and figure out a person like nowhere else and understand the essence and meaning.
So, really, prison gives, adds very healthy thoughts to your head, and you really start thinking about things you would never have thought about before, that is….

Pavlovich:
For example?

Carder:
Well, for example, after leaving prison, I maintain a fairly healthy lifestyle, I keep myself in shape, I even despite, let's say, my binges and carousing, I try to devote every day to learning, I try to learn something new. As funny as it may sound, I even tried to do yoga there, yes, that is, I try everything, and I understand that in reality we only have one life, and we need to value it, and we need to treasure it,
as trite as it sounds, in reality not all people understand this and many simply waste their lives and waste their brains and waste their time in vain, when this time can really be used effectively and even effectively by resting. That is, instead of, let's say, I'll give a very simple example, as stupid as it sounds, instead of, let's say, going out every day drinking beer in
the yard with sunflower seeds, you can simply sum up all these beer events once a month and, for example, go have a good rest in the sauna, the same with all other aspects of life, just take every day, don't do this, but devote, let's say, once or twice a month and go to the sauna and really have a good rest with the guys, spend time, well, you must admit, this is a big difference, you can first go to a club, then to a sauna, that is, this is what you come to, oddly enough.
The example is, of course, idiotic, but you come to this in that you only have one life and you begin to appreciate it. And you don't drink now? Almost no. Almost no. I drink, but I drink very little. But on holidays, right? On holidays, yes. I try to behave like this, once a week. I try not to upset my other half and I could get some coding or something else.
Maybe I'll come to this yet, but I don't see that I have any problems there, not with alcohol, not with substances, because well now I have a wonderful time the way I want and basically, well, when I really started doing something, I started to implement my ideas productively. That is, you just need to understand that the plane comes first and everything else comes later. And as soon as you start focusing on some more important things, you start working.
But as soon as the most important thing loses its meaning, every little thing takes on significance, and then you start to scatter again. It's just important to focus on something and go towards your goal, I think.

How much do you earn now?
Pavlovich:
How much do you earn now per month?

Carder:
About in rubles or in dollars?

Pavlovich:
In dollars, of course.

Carder:
About 5,000 dollars.

Pavlovich:
Plus or minus, right?

About the American justice system and modern cybercrime.
Carder:
Plus or minus from three to five thousand dollars, that is, I can take, I do not disdain to take some work on the opwork, I do not disdain, again, to conduct some kind of audit if there are again some targets, something can be done, but I will say one thing, yes, I do not want to go back behind bars, I understand that America is such crap, yes, that is, well, again, I am not dissuading anyone, yes, I am saying this, guys,
flood and God bless you in your endeavors, but it’s just that the Americans are such evil bastards, they have all the time in the world, that is, you will not do anything with America, you will not do anything with their system, you will not organize a coup there or appoint your own president, it’s just a machine in which gears slowly slowly slowly turn and these gears sooner or later 20-30 years, there is such an old Soviet proverb, yes, everything secret becomes apparent. Sooner or later, someone from the environment will be caught, something else, yes, and the strings of all these people will be pulled. Even practice shows, yes, those people who, well, now especially the new generation, let's say, well, cybercriminals, yes, scammers, they try to reduce contacts to a minimum, yes, they change nicknames and... But even so, let's say, yes, I saw these new cases, they find people, conduct, yes, they even analyze behavior styles, that is, they always adapt.
In fact, if you screwed up somewhere in relation to America, then sooner or later, well, be prepared that you need to keep some lube ready somewhere, to understand that sooner or later you will get it.

How the Americans identified a Ukrainian carder through Jabber.
Pavlovich:
The other day, one American investigator, he is more of a researcher, just working with the special services, told me how they found through Jabber, identified one important carder in Ukraine. There were no leads to him, but in the correspondence, for example, I am this carder, I am corresponding with you, and I am writing to you that a daughter was born the day before yesterday, they named her Milana, this happened in Ukraine.
And I have no leads to me, but somehow they take this piece of your log from this Jabber and they just see that this guy, they check, they call, how many girls were born in Ukraine at that time there, well, on such-and-such a day, for example, and then after some time, when the birth certificate is already recorded in the registry office, the name is entered there, and they check Milan. And it turned out that at that time these girls, later named Milan, were only two in Ukraine.
That's how they found this guy.

Carder:
What are you even talking about, if they have a system, for example, called Palantir, which simply collects big data, it simply collects them from all sources, they have an echelon, they have everything that Snowden revealed, that is, there is a bunch, it is just a question of how much they need you, and they can identify traffic, even if it is encrypted, someday the keys will be found for it, they will decrypt it,
that is, I am not talking about when I want to do something, let's say, criminal, yes, specifically there to enter some card somewhere, I think about it 10 times and 20 times think about which proxy and who is at odds with whom and, for example, if I immediately use some Chinese VPN, to which I connect from Russia and through this VPN I connect to some
Iranian SOCKS and then there is such a story in short, you confuse your tracks, you use, you confuse your tracks and you should never forget about this, that is, you should never forget about this because that even well, in your story, who stole your money, yes, you can always pull the ball up to the end, yes, just let's say the person had an IP address that was linked to his email during registration, that is, he registered and this IP address was saved.
That's all. You can strengthen the person, it would seem that it was 5 years ago, when he registered this email, he did not even attach any importance to it.

Pavlovich:
Well, or like Ross Ulbricht, he once registered his email with this domain.

Carder:
Yes, and that's it. Well, domains in general, domain tools and everything else, they are hidden. Domains are understandable, but the person once registered an email with them, while still living, let's say, somewhere else, but at the same time, again, this is a lead that can be pulled. And the Americans have this system, I just saw their computers, I saw their systems, and well, let's say, like we have some Maltega to Cherry 3, these are these public TOLs that you can
see here, yes, which exhibit, build chains of some events by which you can search, structure and again combine, build some causes and consequences, so they have this system, it's been brought to, well, I won't say ideal, but it's very, very high-quality, yes, and they can search, and they can track how it's connected, how it's connected by words, that is, they have a real search engine that searches the entire database, knowledge, well, the only thing is,
that in America there is separately, let's say, secret service, secret service is a security service, yes, and these organizations are at odds, let's say the FBI, secret service, they are not friends. That is, if it comes down to it, yes, a scythe met a stone.

Pavlovich:
But like in our country, like the FSB and the Ministry of Internal Affairs, they are not very close to each other.

Carder:
They are. The same thing there, yes, they constantly have this feud between organizations and, of course, if a scythe met a stone and they really catch someone, then they catch someone together. But if there are some small options, let's say, well, in my case, a person from the FBI requested the FBI for the second district, they sent my laptop to the secret service, the secret service
refused.

Who was handling your case?
Pavlovich:
And who was handling your case, as I understand it, the US Secret Service, right?

Carder:
I had two districts, that is, one district was for cashing out, that is, cashing out 10 million RBS, when the Royal Bank of Scotland processing was hacked and the ATMs were simply giving out unlimited money. Yes, I remember that. Yes, that is, we were great at cashing out all those cases there. Specifically, my participation there was something like 150 thousand dollars.
Did you film it? Yes, I filmed it. Well, that is, not only me, some of my guys in Moscow filmed it. The second district was Wirefrot and specifically the dumps that were sold and everything else, but the accusation was wire fraud and it actually included the store and all those sales.

Pavlovich:
It was in two, you say districts, in two districts.

Carder:
In two districts, yes. That is, one district was Columbia, it was the central case and the second district was Washington DC, and the second district was Atlanta, Well, that's because RBS found Georgie, I also remember how they were spinning this case with Atlanta, that is, they had to constantly send me updates, there were more and more new names.
In fact, it was not even those who sold the dumps who suffered from me more, but those who bought them, because basically a large number of clients sent me, say, Western Union data or something else, and specifically all the people who bought from me, if they were in the States, then they were re-attached instantly, in general, I don't know what is happening to them now, but I would like, of course, to offer my condolences.
Or apologies. Well, that's how it happened.

Pavlovich:
Already. It happened. So, in general, who was in charge of the case? Secret Service?

Carder:
Again, the FBI was in charge in Atlantica, Secret Service was in charge here. The FBI just spat, they gave up and they let me go with this case altogether. That is, they didn't even take me there to court. And I got it specifically in DC. That was a rarity when they transferred some parts of the case to DC, combined the case, they did that quite often.
That is, you would have gotten two, let's say, two terms.

Pavlovich:
And they could go there one after another, or together. And it is the judge who chooses. Well, the addition of sentences, or there, figuratively speaking. Or they go in parallel. Yes, or they go one after another, in short.

A judicial error for 15 years?!
Carder:
By the way, they froze when, when they entered the sentence into the computer, they made a mistake and they did that one after the other they go and it turned out that I should sit for 15 years and at the same time it turns out that the longer sentence prevails and I should have sat for six and a half years, well, like we have a more serious article, it absorbs it, it absorbs the seriousness of the menu, and they counted they made a mistake and when I just, that is, I remember it’s called RND, when you come and they say, yes, buddy, you have to sit for 15 years, this is generally not worth it, I say what 15 years, they say, well, well, don’t worry so much, we thought, you know, here are 15 years, please, don’t worry, everything is fine, I froze, of course, in general, I call Arkashka then, I say, Arkashka, you screwed me, you bastard, you scumbag.
And he was your lawyer? He was my lawyer, yes, and by the way, I recommend contacting him, despite the fact that he is a very scabby and greedy comrade, but he is a good person and working with him, well, he is the only lawyer with whom it makes sense to work, because in fact you can do without a lawyer at all, yes, Butler, for example, well, he is now doing wonderfully without a lawyer and he received, in principle, the minimum sentence for these things with drones, yes, for what he imported, that is, we came up with a very cool business.

About the brilliant hacker Max Ray Butler.
Pavlovich:
Max Ray Butler, he is described in my book, one of the most, I think, probably, talented carders in the world, right?

Carder:
Now I will tell you about Butler, well, because he has already received a sentence for this, yes, in general, the comrade did a very cool thing, yes.

Pavlovich:
Where did you cross paths with him?

Carder:
I crossed paths with him in Forbes Dixie, that is... Is this a prison or a pretrial detention center? This is a prison, that is, when I was already assigned to the prison, I crossed paths with him in Forbes Dixie. Butler is a racist, first of all, that is, he doesn’t like blacks at all, yes. And he kind of hung out with whites, and when they told him he was a hacker, that is, we, well, went and discussed it. That’s it. Then, in short, blacks beat him up and it turned out that we didn’t talk to each other for a while.
That’s it. Then, when my situation in prison had already stabilized, someone in the transit camp told me again that they knew this hacker, he was a super hacker, in general, everyone there. And the man was just returning there, that is, he was sent to court and he was returning, he was supposed to return again to the prison he was going to after the trial. That is, he was transferred to court and he was supposed to return.
I passed on to this person how to contact me, that is, how to get out, and Butler contacted me and I gave him the money, that is, we sent him money so that he could buy himself a phone. He had no money.

How much does a phone cost in the American zone?
Pavlovich:
How much does a phone cost in the American zone? In the American zone, a phone costs from 1,000 to 5,000 dollars. Again, it depends on the zone, that is, in general, American zones are divided into camps, a camp is a camp, there is not even a fence there, that is, there are usually just tents and from these tents you go to work.

Pavlovich:
I'll interrupt, it's like a penal colony for us, there is no fence, there is just a line, you can't go beyond the line, but the other day some guys who were in American prisons told me. He says, you or I, for example, would not end up in this prison.

About work in American camps: on an ATV on the beach?!
Carder:
They are only for citizens. They are only for citizens, because emigration, a person can simply leave it. And it is the emigration law that holds him, not the prison law. That is, they, there are such people, that is, with me, according to points, well, according to my danger, yes, they do not say that I am some kind of hardcore or something else, yes, a swindler, so to speak. And according to points, I got into the camp, that is, I had to sit in the camp and work, just all the people who sit in the camp, they work and fork out a solid jackpot, that is, they bring in profit.
Well, I will probably tell you the most famous camp in the States is Pennsylvania. Pennsylvania is Florida and there is a very wonderful job there. That is, I know a man who worked, he rode an ATV along the beach and collected trash after soldiers who came there with chicks, that is, he rode in short shorts of special cut-offs, because it is simply very hot there.
I rode a quad bike in shorts with a little scoop and a pig all day on the beach. That is, if he wanted to swim, no one scolded him for it in the sea. Then it was just, well, he collected trash on the beach. They paid him some pennies for this, but the work itself was simply wonderful, yes, I think.

Where were you sitting?
Pavlovich:
And what was your minimum security?

Carder:
Then I ended up, yes, Ford Dix is the largest prison, not a prison, but a zone in the States. That is, there are 5,000 prisoners there. It is a converted army base. By the way, there is a very cool view of the landing planes.
That is, you can see either F-16s landing, or military. That is, this is a runway, and here is a Ford Dixit. Well, very cool. The largest prison and there is probably the most traffic telephone and everything so ford x cell phones cell phones cost 2 thousand dollars cell phones come through the fence guards bring and very rarely very hard to persuade no one wants to lose their job that is corruption among American prisoners let's say no yes in state prisons there are federal well just federal good salaries good social package and well so no one will risk that is so that well so that well someone would risk bringing a phone and they are also searched and they inform on each other and it is widespread there well that is cigarettes well they bring cigarettes and a phone for a phone they punish very harshly and he is appointed loses his job the guard will not take the phone well how much can you offer well maybe for 20 thousand dollars he will bring it, but firstly you have to have a good trusting relationship, secondly I knew a man who got 27 years, that is he sat 27 years, and of these 27 years he sat 8 years in one prison, and for 8 years he knew one guard, that is, they are already like friends with him, he comes to work, he says here and there, there they are just in gold with him, he has a wife, They will ask you and me where the phone is from and they will find out that I am talking to you and even if you do not tell me, I will fall under suspicion and there will be problems.
The man says yes indeed, because he really does talk to him, he is on good terms with this guard. He says yes, I do not want to set you up, that is, such is the system.
And in the end, how does the phone get in? Over the fence, that is, one runs up, distracts the guard on the tower, at this time the second accurately throws some kind of projectile like an American football over the fence.

Pavlovich:
Well, and they do not have all sorts of traps there, like we had in the zone, you know what, they flew at us with these throws, well, some kind of slingshot, a catapult, but there were nets like in school for volleyball and they were very, very high.

Carder:
There. They are standing there, not only there is a no-knock sign and a dividing strip, but they throw very accurately, and they also cut the fence, let's say, purposefully, that is, they somehow trample a path and cut through the fence. Moreover... But the fence is not concrete, like ours? No, not concrete. Wire. That is, there is about ten meters, probably, the distance between the two fences and another twenty meters of no-knock sign.
So they cut through the first grate and then they stomp along the no-knock sign. When the alarm goes off, they throw their projectile and a person picks it up there. Then he hides it all. It is clear that the guards raise a fuss, the compound or territory is closed, everyone is searched and that's it. And they wait for the moment when this sign can be opened. Then they open it and this is specifically what people do.
And how much do they put into the mobile at a time? 2-3, but usually more is also grass, burs, some personal orders. What burs? Burs, heroin. That's the topic. That is, it is very respected in prison, especially the white guys, they are there for it. All sorts of pills, chemistry.

How much do drugs cost in American prisons?
Pavlovich:
And how much do drugs cost in an American prison?

Carder:
How much do drugs cost? Well, I'll put it this way, a check of heroin costs 5 dollars.
One dose is 5 dollars. One dose is 5 dollars.

Pavlovich:
And grass, for example, a joint of grass, how much does it cost?

Carder:
A joint of grass is 3 dollars, a cigarette is 5 dollars. That is, cigarettes are not sold, cigarettes can be bought. But in general, smoking is prohibited everywhere in American prisons. Even guards are prohibited. Because in a federal prison. You can smoke in a state prison. A cigarette costs from 5 to 10 dollars, it costs the same.

Speaker?:
Joint.

Pavlovich:
Is it true that several people chip in to buy a cigarette, say? Yes, maybe 5-6 people buy it. Isn't it crazy for one drag?

Carder:
Well, people smoke, I don't know, they like it. We smoked together, we smoked constantly too. You go out, let's say, well, I started at Ford-Dixie.

Pavlovich:
With what? That pack of cigarettes costs between 100 and 200 dollars.

Carder:
In fact, what did I start with at Ford-Dixie? Yes, somewhere around 100-120 dollars a pack of cigarettes. We made a moonshine still, made mash, and simply broke off a spiral from an exercise bike, and from this spiral we plugged it into an outlet and boiled it out, drove out the vapors, drove out the mash, and it turned out that it accumulated. That is, the method was like this, in fact, if God forbid someone gets caught, here I am sharing the secret of how it is done.
A large barrel or some kind of garbage bucket, the mash is poured into it, a smaller container is inserted into it, which floats on the surface, a bag is put on top of all this crap, and it is inserted into the mash, a boiler is inserted into the liquid itself, some kind of heating device.
It can be any spiral, well, that is, not any iron spiral, it can be, well, this thing is immersed there, it heats up, respectively, alcohol, well, the biggest secret is that alcohol is executed, that is, ethanol, it evaporates at 70 degrees, water evaporates at 100, that is, you just do not let this liquid boil, but at the same time, you see ethanol, it condenses and you take some kind of spray bottle with water and knock down this ethanol, spray, it turns out that this condensate begins to cool and it begins to drip right into this vessel, which is floating in the middle, right in the liquid.
Well, even after the first distillation, you get a mixture that burns. I sold a bottle of moonshine for 50 dollars, competing with a black guy who sold it for 60, the black guy had better quality. He had bananas, I didn't have any, they brought him some black. So what did you make the mash from? Bread, as much bread as possible, that is, I threw in bread, fruits, vegetables, just everything that I managed to bring from the canteen.
Do you have sugar? Sugar is very hard to get, it's under control, that is, it's like, well, if they stole it, that is, there are usually these big guys there, they usually, well, I've never seen anything like that. They threw this huge bag of sugar, I mean, they really threw it, a truck drove up there, they disarmed the truck. And this bag, probably 50 or 40 kilograms, they managed to throw it 10 meters with sugar.
Over the fence. Over the fence, yes, that is, where they disarm, here where the kitchen is, yes, they threw it to people and they would lift it and drag it together. Well, there are really huge guys working there. How much did a kilogram of sugar cost, for example, in the zone? A kilogram of sugar, it was not sold in kilograms, it was sold in tea bags. That is, not tea bags, but those were juice bags. And sugar could be obtained in another way, sorry to distract you, from candy.
That is, candy was sold in a kiosk, these lollipops and you could also get sugar from them. In principle, this sugar was used everywhere.

Pavlovich:
I bought sugar in the Belarusian zone by the kilogram. Well, they also stole something from the canteen there, sold something around the camp. For 5 dollars a kilo. Sugar is not allowed. That is, in the Belarusian zone you can’t get it at all. It’s like there isn’t any.

Speaker 1:
There too.

Pavlovich:
In the morning, they give you sweet tea at most. That's it. Well, that's it. No sugar. And I, for one, don't want to drink that tea in the morning. I want to drink my sweet tea. That's it. $5 a kilo. But they don't sell it yet. I think they sell it so they don't put it in the moonshine, but at the same time, as you already said, these lollipops and candies are freely sold in the kiosk.

Carder:
Well, this moonshine just tastes so nasty after these lollipops. You can immediately tell what the moonshine is made with. I made it with candy, sugar costs $20 for this bag, there's no kilo there, it's probably somewhere around 600-700 grams.

Pavlovich:
In short, a kilo there will be $30.

Carder:
A kilo is $30, yes. I know this bag, a forty-kilogram one, went for a thousand dollars.

Chicks-security guards, sex with a female security guard?!
Pavlovich:
Are there any female security guards?

Carder:
There were and have been those who fucked for money miss, such a huge black woman with a huge one, only black women have such healthy asses and she just walked, that is, she has this ass, it protrudes like this, she walked and asked yes miss, I don’t remember what her name is, damn, I won’t say, yes, she’s such a hat, such a snub nose, and she walked around shaking this ass.
So, she had a pimp in the zone, who collected money from a stall for the fact that she sucked in the toilet for 200 dollars. And then he somehow made these settlements with her. It cost 200 dollars to suck, so she sucked for 200 dollars.

Pavlovich:
And so there are no long-term dates, right?

Carder:
There are no long-term dates in federal prison at all. That is, as soon as you start kissing, touching, that’s it, there’s an immediate expense.

Pavlovich:
How long did you spend under investigation in total? So, before the verdict? In America, under investigation is 2 years. Are there any restrictions, like here, for example, in Belarus? Yes, I had a particularly serious article, and they could keep me under investigation for a maximum of 1.5 years, and another year for the trial. That is, according to the law, 2.5 years. Of course, they have tricks when they can extend it. You know, for example, they singled out episodes from my case where I was with accomplices in one case, where I was alone in another.
And so they start the terms anew for each case. But in general, the maximum is 2.5 years. Is that true in the States?

Carder:
Yes, there is a big difference between where you sit before the trial and after the trial. Firstly, before the trial you sit in a cell, it really is a cell. Well, like our pretrial detention center. Yes, a pretrial detention center, yes. That is, you sit in a cell. After the trial, it's all the usual, all the prisons are open, that is, it's clear that you have the whole day to party, Fordyx has a great gym, you have books, a library, competitions, songs, dances, in short, all your own, a bunch of your own, as they call it, homies, right?

How and why the Americans set up Konstantin Yaroshenko.
Carder:
That is, there were 52 Russian people in Fordyx, that is, not Russians, Russian speakers, well, the most famous one was Kostya Yaroshenko.

Pavlovich:
The one they wanted to change, to get out.

Carder:
The pilot, yes. But he went crazy, there was a great pity for him, of course, the guy there has really gone crazy. And he is not guilty. He really is not guilty, they set him up. They tried to set him up for a boot, and Kostya turned on the Russian officer and, in short, refused at all. And there was nothing there, there was nothing there in fact. They just came to him, the Americans, and said, if we gave you cocaine, would you transport it?
Kostya says no, no cocaine. I mean, I saw the documents. But what if we sold you a plane? He says yes, if you sold me a plane, of course I would kiss your ass. But they say, okay, let's sign a contract, we'll sell you a plane on an installment plan for 50 years, please, make us a down payment, and Kostya had two or three planes, and a third or fourth wouldn't hurt him. And he says great, okay, let's do it. And they signed a contract for this plane.
And they automatically assumed that he was going to transport cocaine on it. Although they made the offer to him themselves. That is, they made him this offer. In essence, they set him up. The American authorities. Yes. They did it to him, yes. When they, well, they secured him in Africa. He worked in Africa all the time. They knocked out his teeth, first of all, well, Africans, probably, not Americans.

Pavlovich:
Americans don't beat you in prison?

Carder:
They don't, no. Well, they can put you in such places, put you with blacks, where they'll beat you to death or in some shitty place. Or in solitary confinement, right? Or in solitary confinement, yes, but the Americans themselves don't beat you, even if you bark at them like crazy. That's it. And in short, Kostya, they just came to him and said, listen, we'll let you go, just testify against Bout. Against Viktor Bout, right? And Bout is, well, everyone knows that he's Sechin's comrade.
An arms dealer. An arms dealer, that is, they wanted, in general, the Americans' scheme was such that Yaroshenko would give up Bout and Bout would break under pressure and give up Sechin, and Sechin would already be clear to whom he was leading, that is, everything was already clear here. That is, they just wanted a high-profile political case. But nothing came of it. Kostya turned on the Russian officer and got 35 years. And he lost his mind. He lost his mind.
They always say, Russia will pull me out. Of course, they sent a priest to him, they brought him icons, but it didn't help him, because his wife went on a spree, his daughter is also there all the time, he has a completely old daughter, about 15 or 14, she also set up a telemarket there and it knocked him down yes it knocked him down and what will he do well, that is, even if he wanted to change something, his plane had already flown away

About the verdict.
Pavlovich:
basically, you sit in France for two years, two years before the trial, and even then four years, after four years you receive the verdict, so to speak, but how does that look? Are you going to court?

Carder:
Yes, they brought him to court, that is, a special session, everything is solemn, a hall paneled with wood. Uncle, aunt. Uncle, aunt, yes, someone came, stand up, the trial is in progress. I have a judge, by the way, I was very lucky with my judge, thank you very much, Erin Sigal-Houvel. A woman? A woman, yes. And, well, some people are less lucky. Some have such, well, people have come across blacks, yes, or people who are unhappy with life.
And I have one just like that, you can tell by her, she’s a woman of about 50, well-groomed, she’s just glowing, you can tell from her that everything is good in her life, you just know, it’s written right on her face: I have everything good, husband, children, family, everything is great, and you’re standing there in a robe and shackles, and I’m standing there in a robe and shackles, smiling, of course, so she looks at me and she says, well, you know, she says, I’m like a new one for you for the future, I’ll advise you to use your mind.
In fact, many people have given me these admonitions, so that you use your mind for its intended purpose. For peaceful purposes. For peaceful purposes, yes. And not the way you used it. In the end, she says, I’m deliberately giving you a very lenient sentence, because I see that you want to improve and everything is fine.
That is, really, instead of 50 years, getting 7 is very godly.

About shackles, handcuffs, the color of the robe.
Pavlovich:
And the robes, we’re talking about what color are the robes? I just saw orange, beige.

Carder:
Robes of any color.

Pavlovich:
Any, right?

Carder:
Each prison has its own, beige in the Ford Dixie, orange when they transport you, that is, it is required by the standard, orange robes, yes. It is good so that you can see from afar. And they tie you up, the most unpleasant thing is that this is already an achaism, yes, but they tie you to someone and you walk in pairs, that is, so that you, well, if you run away, then slowly, yes, and also you sit tied up in the bus in shackles on your legs. The guards hate this, because you have to put these shackles on. And people hate this, because it is hellishly uncomfortable for them.
Especially if the bus goes far. There is a toilet there. But if you go, for example, to relieve yourself, then the person stands right behind you and he looks at this whole story. And the shackles turn out to be this.

Pavlovich:
The kind of handcuffs that go on your legs?

Carder:
On your legs, yes, like handcuffs, only on chains. Bigger. And the chain is longer, right? Yes, and the chain is longer.

Pavlovich:
And are they connected to the handcuffs?

Carder:
Yes, connected to the handcuffs by a chain in the middle. And the handcuffs are connected to your brother in misfortune, too.

Pavlovich:
And you're standing here in this robe, so it turns out you're being read the verdict.

Carder:
No, they don't take off the shackles and handcuffs in the courtroom. Are you standing in a cage? No, you're not standing by the table, that is, you can't reach the judge's table, but the most interesting video can be found on YouTube, yes, when some black guy is told that you committed a murder, a big, big one, and the sentence is read out back and forth and the judge says life, like life imprisonment, in short, and as soon as she says life, in short, a lawyer is standing next to him, and the black guy goes bang right in his snout, in short, someone just couldn't break away from the judge, so at least the lawyer, yes.

Pavlovich:
And is the lawyer present somewhere next to you at this time?

Carder:
The lawyer is standing right next to you, that is, someone to the right or left of you. Well, the black guy reached him, and he just immediately says, life, here!

How much did you pay the lawyer, what would have happened if you had no money?
Pavlovich:
How much did it cost you to pay for Bukh's services?

Carder:
100 thousand dollars.

Pavlovich:
That's for the entire time he was supervising you, right? A little more, maybe 120. If you didn't have that money to pay him, what would have happened?

Carder:
Well, going back again, going back to the fact that you can do without money, but you have to understand very well, we actually wanted to create a system for a long time that would simply explain to people what to do, that is, how to behave, how to behave with agents, what to say, what not to say, how to behave in prison, that is, the Lion's share of everything, it has to be, here is a lawyer, yes, exactly what he persuades prosecutors, talks with them, persuades agents, that is, he, in principle, he does nothing in court, he does not file petitions, there, if he filed with me, there, 2-3 papers of some kind, then, but at the same time he conducts some, but at the same time you yourself can conduct all these conversations, and they, in principle, all meet you halfway, you can talk to them, it is just important to understand what?
It is important to understand that you should know very well what to tell you. I have had many times that I just went crazy and I say everything. I can’t. I’ll send them all to hell now. They are finished Americans. Whatever happens. And Arkady says to me, stop, wait, breathe out. Yes, everything is fine. Yes, no, they are fools. Yes, no, just wait, breathe out. Everything is fine.
Everything will go well now. That is, in fact, you also need to understand that with the government, yes, with the American government, everything is arranged on trust. That is, they tell me, give me the password to the crypto. We give you this. Yes, but at the same time, there are no written agreements on their part. They don’t recognize anything. There is this pleodil, there they pleodil, well, pleodil, this is actually not much. It won’t give anything. That is why they also gave him 50 years.
That is, platgil, this is important, that is, platgilty, if you have it written, immediately minus 15 points. Well, in fact, let's say, when you have 500 million loss damage, it will not play any role for you at all.

Pavlovich:
That is, all the agreements, they are behind the scenes and they can screw you.

Carder:
They are completely behind the scenes and they are in any, for example, like what happened with Vega, they simply should have let him go from the courtroom, he did not tell them something, he got into trouble with them, he sent the wrong person to fuck off and that's all for him, really, even before the trial, even after the trial, even the judge who was with him, he was indignant, you say you really screwed the guy, they immediately after the trial in another district stuck him with another case although they should not have, that is, they stuck him with he was tried in California, and he was stuck with it in New York for money laundering.
Although this case did not exist at all initially, even according to American law, he can be tried, that is, the Americans have an agreement with Europe and you can only be tried for what you were extradited for.
That is, these charges on the basis of which you were extradited, you can be tried for this. And in the case of Boa, all this was violated, that is, he was extradited on one charge, and tried for something completely different. But in the US, as far as I understand, everything goes unpunished, right? With the US, of course, but what about us? Well, it's like that everywhere, their own courts, their own rules.