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Sergey Pavlovich continues to talk with one of the most famous hackers - Roman "BOA" Vega. In this interview, Roman told about his long journey of imprisonment in American prisons.
Contents:
Weren't you afraid of the consequences?
Pavlovich:
When you entered this field of carding in 2001-2002, by that time you had already encountered all the power and lawlessness, let it be American intelligence services and so on. Weren't you afraid that you would turn the American world against yourself even more and sooner or later you would have to answer for it? Or did you not think about it at all at that moment?
Carder:
The thing is that among my, let's say, clients, customers, including Secret Service, I knew perfectly well how they work. From A to Z. They have their own specific structure. I know a little about the matter, how different intelligence services work. Well, if you take Secret Service, they are so unprofessional that I was simply surprised myself.
That is, there were a number of episodes when, well, grannies from the market, they were, so to speak, more professional than Secret Service. And so, because I had worked with them before, well, I mean, not worked, but... I encountered them.
Yes, they were the clients, I knew their structure, and when they started to torture me, I simply knew which buttons to press. So, it all worked at once, in principle, from, there, some kind of, New York field office to the State Department, because they are very, not just bureaucratic, they are very.
Well, when they took Gonzalez, and suddenly Jake comes running, he is their main specialist on Russia. He says, Roma, listen, this goat, it turns out that not only did he receive 300 thousand a year from us, he also, it turns out, took T.J. Max here and so on. Well, we'll bury him. I say, Zhenya, why are you telling me this, who I am, so to speak, a complete outsider?
Well, I need to share it with someone.
Background:
Albert Gonzalez is an American carder and cybercriminal who was accused of carding and reselling over 170 million bank card numbers between 2005 and 2007. Gonzalez received 20 years.
Pavlovich:
Well, nevertheless, you see, with their, as you say, unprofessionalism, they were able to put you away for 18 years, and me, and Gonzalez, and Psycho for 27, and a bunch of other guys. The latest one was that guy Dirayo, then Levashov Severa, who was on the planet, that spammer, that is, in principle, they managed to reach a lot of cybercriminals.
Carder:
Chancellery. Please. I don’t agree with the word “managed to put away.” It wasn’t Severa who managed to put away, but he, in fact, very much so. Severa worked for about twenty or thirty years, right?
Reference:
Petr Levov (Severa) was sentenced to 33 months in prison in the United States. The prosecution asked for at least 12 years, but the judge sentenced him to 33 months, finding that the estimates of the damage he had caused were exaggerated. The "King of Spam" was arrested in Spain in 2007.
Pavlovich:
But, in general, they managed to punish all those whom we knew as active criminals. That is, effectively-ineffectively, but, nevertheless, they achieved their goals and punished many demonstratively severely.
Carder:
You call me a criminal who fights for peace throughout the world?
The effectiveness of the methods of special services in combating crimes
Pavlovich:
Well, okay, but you still did your commercial cases against affecting interests in the United States and other countries. As did I and many others, you know, from those whom we know. And they punished demonstratively, cruelly, like the same psycho 27 years old and so on. That is why the States do it all the time. You know, I read in my documents and other documents from the Ministry of Justice, when they boast in their press releases that we managed to pull off such an operation.
And they say that we, in cooperation with our colleagues from that department, from that Interpol, Europol, and other international intelligence agencies, managed to punish such-and-such people, and thus we show that you do not steal from us, otherwise the punishment will be sooner or later, and it will be quite severe.
Carder:
And the question?
Pavlovich:
The question is that they still work, as it were, quite effectively, you understand? That is, not always legally, sometimes lawlessly and so on, but retribution will be shot. Retribution is meted out to those who affect the interests of the United States. I wrote an article that you are stealing somewhere and so on, but okay, there is Europe and so on, Asia, but it is quite dangerous for the United States to really encroach on their interests, to play on their field.
Carder:
It is dangerous.
Pavlovich:
In any sphere. In yours it is military, in ours it is common cybercrime.
Carder:
It is dangerous. It is dangerous. Well, I don't think they'll last long, because there's universal hatred there. In the States? Absolutely. That is, both in prison and outside, I lived there and lived there.
Everyone hates everyone, that is, whites hate blacks, they hate them, and there are only 18% of them there.
Pavlovich:
Whites?
Who are sitting in US prisons.
Carder:
No, not robbers, thank God. Already more, almost half. Latinos, well, Latinos are everyone from Latin America, there are Mexicans, and Salvadorans of all kinds, and so on. They are waiting, and the Indians, they are just waiting for it all to end. Well, those who haven't drunk themselves to death yet. I was accepted into the Sioux-Lacoda tribe, and they say, Roma, we'll wait, it will all pass, just like that, calmly.
But hatred within the states, interracial, it's not just seething, it's just something so wild, I'm surprised they're still alive. You see, that's what.
And in this regard, I think we don't need to worry about the States, they'll fall apart on their own, quietly.
Pavlovich:
The first meeting of carders in Odessa, which was somewhere in 2001 or 2004, and the last one, but there were also more local ones, we met there in our circle more than once and often in different countries, we visited each other on vacation, someone from the company paid for all this, so we come to your country, you invite us, you pay there as a rule.
The first meeting of carders
Carder:
No, Seryozha, but the first and only conference of carders, official, when this dance, what is it called, I forgot what it's called, well in Odessa there is some big dance, we are sitting here smoking weed and then they say, and this song sounds again for carders and for all of Odessa.
Pavlovich:
How many people were there, plus or minus?
Carder:
Well, somewhere around 30, that is, well, there were ours, Canada, the Baltics, Ukraine, Russia, of course, but some, whom, you already know, were personally told, under no circumstances should you come, so that you don’t get exposed. Well, basically, people finally saw each other. There were guys from Belarus, two people.
Well, we made a lot of noise there throughout Odessa.
Pavlovich:
Yes, they still remember. In the States, there is a website, this bureau in recognition, yes, bob.Gov, I watched you too when, well, I was already released, you were still sitting around...
Carder:
Listen, what a great phrase, I was already released, and you were still sitting.
What do transfers and dates look like in the USA
Pavlovich:
Yes, I was waiting for the time when I could finally meet you in person and talk like this. And I watch Drinkman through the same website, grief and so on. And there are some cool moments there, well, first of all, you can find any inmate, that is, a prisoner, see when he is getting out plus or minus, again, all sorts of paroles are taken into account there, and your number and everything else.
And there is an item, for example, call or email, for example, call or send an email, then send, I see, a package, send money, a visit, that is, sign up for a date, then some kind of voice concern, that is, it can be some kind of voice message, how it all looks in US prisons in general, that is, it is some kind of convenient human process, not like ours, these lines for a date with packages and everything else.
Carder:
Seryozha, well, first of all, in order for you to get on a date, you need to be approved by the prison, that's why there is a whole process, that is, the inmate, well, I mean the prisoner must fill out an application and it must be approved. You will be questioned if you are not from the States, that is, you do not have these social security and all that stuff, then it is easier, that’s it, but on the other hand, in each
in prison it is different, that is, for example, the BBC guys tried to get through to me, they just took them, well, and said no, for the security of prison and the expense. Well, well, they don’t like the press. Well, but to send a parcel, well, please, send it, but it won’t work.
Why? They are simply prohibited, in principle, all parcels.
Pavlovich:
Well, and some books, for example, there?
Carder:
Well, and books, yes, and only Only from Amazon, because we are smart, and we know that they wrote Russian Books Worldwide, and here it came, and suddenly there are drugs in the spine, or something else, or some message is pierced there, but this is not everywhere, because in prisons, well, chaos, but the chaos in different prisons is different, office.
In a private book on Pavel, they did not receive from Amazon.
Pavel Ivlev, there is a famous writer, and he signed books and sent them to us in prison, and how did we receive them?
Carder:
I don’t know, they received them without me, I left at that time. In some prisons they allow it to be printed on the envelope, well, on a printer, but not signed by hand, just some printing house of Vasya Pupkin, so if it is readable to them in English, that it is a printing house or a printing house that distributes, yes, some kind of publishing house, then sometimes they let it go.
In federal, well, this is about private, in federal prisons, in my opinion, only Amazon and that’s it. Amazon, yes.
Pavlovich:
And e-mail, for example, is it just brought to you as a letter, right? Is this an alternative to letters?
Carder:
No. There is a system called CoreLinks, and from inside the prison it is called TrueLinks. You can take and sign up, and you will be able to communicate with the person there, he will pay, right? We kind of paid, right? Well, you pay from your account, that is, you... Oh, from your prison account, and again, in federal
Pavlovich:
Firms, there's something like 5 cents a minute, whether you read or write, it makes no difference.
Carder:
Yeah, and you still pay, but it's like e-mail, but inside this Corlinks account.
Carder:
A system for transmitting simple messages, but it has nothing to do with e-mails, a prison one.
Carder:
A social network. A lot of people have fallen over on this Corlinks, because it's all inside their server and they have the right to use it for us in court and that's it. All prosecutors automatically remove all your correspondence.
Pavlovich:
They read. Well, like censorship in prison.
Carder:
They don't read, they just film everything, in case there's something else. I'll give you my two cents about this site, Sergey, your screenshot is open in Biopic, of course there are all these links, send a parcel, write a message, and so on. They all just lead to instructions, they're not something ready-made where you can poke and send a message or a parcel. No, just to instructions, and each specific prison can have its own. Different, yes.
What do convoys look like in the US
Pavlovich:
You've been to 18 different prisons, plus or minus, you might not have counted some transit ones, but you counted at least 18 American ones. We're not counting Nikosiva, Cyprus, where you were detained, Egypt, then whatever, Libya, and between all of them, you've been brought to prison a hundred thousand times. What does convoying look like in the United States? We all know this service, the US Marshals, it's called, it's basically a regular convoy, when in the Soviet Union there were conscripts, contract soldiers.
What does it look like in the US?
Carder:
In the US it looks much tougher than in many places. There, it turns out, there are handcuffs and shackles, i.e. shackles, between them there is a chain, this chain is fastened to the belt, around which there is also the same chain, there is a separate lock dangling.
Pavlovich:
It is a heavy construction, right?
Carder:
It is not heavy in weight, it is extremely inconvenient, because your hands are constantly cut by the handcuffs. You can still scratch your nose, scratch the top of your head is basically impossible, but you can't reach it when your hands are on your belt and on the top of your head, so you have to scratch it on whatever comes to hand. When some kind of transportation takes an hour or two to and from court. God bless him. And when transport is by bus, you travel the whole day.
Pavlovich:
And the plane?
Carder:
Same. On the plane there are also flights, inspections and so on. For the most unlucky, and at first I thought that this was only for the most violent or dangerous, but then it turned out that no, they are somehow random.
Carder:
I ended up in Black Box four times.
Carder:
Black Box is when the handcuffs also snap into a box, after which they become a completely rigid structure.
Carder:
That is, like this, you have handcuffs here, and then there is this little box that you… Which locks the chain… You can only move it.
Carder:
With your fingers and that’s all. And due to the fact that our hands are not parallel, but still grow from the keys, and sort of converge at one point, it constantly crashes, it gets absolutely numb.
Carder:
I flew for six hours once… It’s hard, I tried.
Carder:
I wasn’t particularly dangerous, but they put me on, and my term was not that long.
Carder:
They decide for themselves who is especially dangerous and who is not.
Carder:
In the face, right? They'll hit you in the face.
The difference between private and federal prisons
Pavlovich:
Private prisons and these state ones, yes, federal ones. What are the main differences, in your opinion, and which ones are better?
Carder:
The differences are that in private ones it is easier to come to an agreement with the guards. Agree on what? Well, to bring something. Well, not in federal ones, but in federal ones it is somehow more structured. That is, in federal prisons, well, there are idiots, of course, among the guards, but fewer psychopaths.
In private prisons, I have this, well, over the years, the opinion has formed that psychopaths go to prisons, to private ones, who need something for themselves, to take something, well, they have been milking cows all the time, and suddenly a prison opened for them.
Power appeared.
Pavlovich:
Roman is talking about the guards, not about those who are sitting, but about the workers.
Carder:
Yes, of course, I am talking about them. Well, it's impossible to say which is better, private or federal, because each prison is different, and it doesn't depend on the conditions, but on who the guard is. Specifically, on the personality? Yes, that is, there is someone there, screw him, let's just say the conditions are bad.
If the guards are, let's say, nuts, then, well, it happens. There are a lot of psychopaths. Sadists or just the city's crazy people? They are psychopaths, they are just psychopaths. They came to prison to take and torture.
It is especially difficult in the punishment cell, when psychopaths are found among the guards.
Carder:
I will add one more fundamental difference between federal and private prisons. Private prisons are designed to be self-financing. And, accordingly, everything is more expensive. It is more expensive to live there. In a federal prison, everything seems to be cheaper due to the fact that there the funding comes largely from the budget.
Pavlovich:
Yes. But there are no concessions in terms of the regime, that in a private one you are like in a sanatorium, right?
Carder:
Seryozha, all prisons, each one, whether private or federal, they are all different. Well, well, they are simply different. So you come, like you were born into a new world, oops, and you have to see what is happening, what is it.
Well, but even if the prison is private or federal in the same system, then they, well, they are still different.
Pavlovich:
There were all sorts, you go to Ter-Akhat, and you don’t care that it’s federal.
Carder:
Yes, by the way, and who the hell knows what happens there, you understand? Well, that is, and this, by the way, for the soul, it is a rich experience, that is, you enter each new prison, as if you are entering a new life. And it’s all there, there, there. You entered, you were born. That’s it. And forward.
There are some, and so on.
Are there “red” prisons in the USA?
Pavlovich:
And off we go. And there are some like that, for example, a prison, like the one I was in, well, by Belarusian standards, it's a good, black zone, where the cops don't interfere in your life at all. Don't give them any problems. You can do whatever you want there. The main thing is don't fight too much, play football, go to church, go to the cafeteria, you don't have to go, eat yourself, we kind of fight, but when you get caught, we don't really press you there, right? And just where the administration doesn't fool you, doesn't make you a trained dog, we build a cafeteria and so on, and you just live a normal life, you have everything, but you're just deprived of freedom.
Are there such prisons in the States? Have you ever come across any in yours?
Carder:
Well, it's private, by the way, in York, well, before I was sent last year... And York is not private,
Carder:
York is state.
Carder:
State, right?
Carder:
It's state. That is, yes, all the locals sit there, who broke whose nose, listen, there are so many idiots there. Well, just in general... There are, yes, that is, yes, I remember, that is, well, two or three like you say, well, I had them.
Yeah, that's exactly it, that, guys, you somehow realize yourselves so that you don't cause us problems, but that's purely private, yes.
Pavlovich:
But not federal.
Carder:
Although, again, in a private one you should not give a damn at all. But in the federal one I managed to negotiate not to work, and in the private one I had to go to work in the library. I'm not even talking about the obligatory cafeteria, okay, in the library, we sit and read books. And Roma scrubbed the pan in the kitchen after the chicken.
The first month there was obligatory.
Carder:
Listen, I worked there for six months, yes, it turns out, that is, I worked as an assistant, well, of course, as a manager. Scrubbed for six weeks.
Pavlovich:
Disgusting, huh.
Carder:
Huh? Six weeks. A month of mandatory work, and then until they transfer you, until you find a new job. And this is precisely in a private one, that is, in a private one you couldn’t shirk work, but in a federal one – please.
Pavlovich:
So there’s 100% employment, everyone is obliged to do something, or what?
Carder:
No, in private ones, you enter the zone, you are obliged to work.
Carder:
In the kitchen. Again, it has to do with the fact that it’s self-financing, all the living flesh entering the prison works at the rates of pay there, what is it, 5 dollars a month.
Pavlovich:
Per month?
Carder:
Per month.
Pavlovich:
So, not only with us.
Carder:
Six dollars a month.
Pavlovich:
Well, that’s what you get in hand net after all the deductions, right? Yes.
Carder:
Two soaps and one pipe paste.
Pavlovich:
And they don’t provide any of that, any of that.
Carder:
A set? Of course not.
Carder:
No, they do provide these little soaps. At the entrance? Yes. And in the federal prison, you can come at any time, take some toothpaste and soap.
Carder:
Well, yes, the system is different.
Pavlovich:
And which of all the prisons do you remember, what’s the first thing you remember in a negative light and why?
Carder:
Can I remember something positive?
Pavlovich:
Let’s remember something positive. We’ve already mentioned York.
The most positive prison.
Carder:
Williamsburg, South Carolina, 1,200 inmates. Is that a lot? Average. Usually 2,000-something.
Out of 1200, 200 prisoners, a thousand not blacks, and not that kind of blacks, but 10 and, damn, heavyweights, that is, John, what are you talking about, I killed 7 people here, well, I repented, and so I hope that in 17 years I will get out, well, something like that, and you... And I, you know, I got a shot here, and some kind of scam came up with an unfortunate outcome, and I accidentally robbed a bank here.
I say, well, how much did they give you? Well, 27. Well, fine. And how long did you serve? Well, 12. Well, I say, well, you'll get out soon, so what. That's it. And they threw me into this zone so that I wouldn't organize anyone, because they decided that I wouldn't be able to just go and organize blacks.
1200 were in the zone, and of them 1000 of these blacks, who, well, the scum of the earth, from a chervonets and up, killed, stabbed, robbed, that's it.
Then there were a lot of lifers, lifers are, well, those who live in life.
Pavlovich:
Lifetime, yes.
Carder:
Yes, that's it. And, and then there were a little, well, maybe sixty white people, all drug addicts, and they all had eagles here, gouged out here, like this.
Pavlovich:
Was this some kind of gang of theirs?
Carder:
That's how it's done, you know, in South Carolina, in Georgia, well, and nearby. In North Carolina. Then there were about 60 people, also Latinos, who had American citizenship.
Well, I'm the only foreigner, but it was the best for me there, because I don't have to answer for anyone, that is, none of these Georgians, Armenians, Azerbaijanis, who always have some kind of these...
Pavlovich:
Rams.
Carder:
Yeah, they come up with something. Three guys only have to get together, and they always have some kind of squabbles. And everyone takes part in it, the whole zone. And everyone comes to me and says, Roma, here are yours And the Russians again, I say, listen, so what, did you take drugs and not pay, or something else, or something else. And I felt so good in Williamsburg, that is, I spent a year there, graduated from technical school.
Pavlovich:
What specialty technical school?
Education in American prisons
Carder:
Building those funny wooden houses of theirs. Frame houses of that type. Yeah, I also had a second specialty, like carpenter or something like that. Also correspondence? Well, of course, no, well, we studied there in person, they have their own, well, that is, the gist of it is that how many people sign up for a class for each, they are paid 2800 a year in prison, we are paid somewhere around 16 dollars a month, so, we have to study.
I came to class and said, I want to master the gases of all this. And they say, listen, doesn't it bother you that besides you there will be 24 other people in the class, and 23 of them are not black, and at that, such specific ones.
I say, what do I care, I mean, I came to study. Well, I finished my technique, I even have a certificate and so on. But it was good in Williamsburg, because I learned to play the drums there, it turns out that you have to play the drums from notes.
For me it was a revelation, well, a complete one. Then I taught a Japanese language class there, and here’s another thing, that they get paid, in prison they pay if someone teaches a class of some kind of prisoners, 17 thousand dollars, and they paid me 26.
Pavlovich:
Per month?
Carder:
I don’t remember, well, I think so. Well, but I had four lessons a month, and one of my students was the great-grandson of Emperor Hirohita, a Japanese one. I say, listen, you’re kind of, well, kind of Japanese, he says, “Oh, listen, I have this story there, and all that, I say, well, I know 600 spoken hieroglyphs, well, approximately.”
So, he says, “Roma, please teach me.” I say, do you understand what you’re talking about? So you're talking about the right-wing herohita, and I'm here... Russian. Some Russian from somewhere, well, a fly-by-night. Well, teach me. And then I took him to play the drums. That zone was also interesting because there were a lot of Child Molesters there.
These are songs in Russian. Child molesters. But compared to the Lompoc zone, it's in California, Santa Barbara County, that's the Santa Barbara where... The series. Yeah.
Well, that means we had 2,400 people there, 1,800 of which were them.
Pavlovich:
Child molesters?
Carder:
Yeah. And everyone somehow justified themselves there, they went in groups. And then they started removing us from there, that was somewhere around 2009.
How Boa got into carding
Pavlovich:
When I first found out about you, I was probably 18 years old, I was already on Carder.org, the very first forum. All Western journalists, especially ours, they all insist that the first such carding forum was CarderPlanet. Of course. But before that there was Carder.org and many of the top guys, the same Flint, Auditor, for example, all of them, I don’t remember the rest of the names, they all came from Carder.org, Black Monk and so on.
And then a planet emerges, you appear on the planet, and we consider you to be, you know, one of the Dons of the planet, one of the creators, probably, the father of carding, there is also the age difference, we are just 18, 17, 16 and 13 year old snot-nosed kids there, and you already occupy a high position in this hierarchy, you advance serious topics, it was very interesting to read your texts, because they were always humorous, interspersed with some, you know, other examples from literary works, Elfa Petrov flashed there, something deeper. And we, of course, looked at you with admiration then. But specifically about what you do, here are the cards, I was once in Odessa at Leviathan, and for the first time I saw counterfeit plastic.
Of course, we were already up to something there, running some eBay scams, auctions, drinking stuff carding from credit cards, but then I saw some fake cards, and Lyubyafan told me that these were cards from Boa, and basically I then compared your activities on the forum and these cards, and how did you even get into carding from all this activity connected with the special services, from this job in particular, and when?
Carder:
Well, it's all simple. I had a number of companies, and they really got on my nerves, that is, and, well, let's say this way, although we worked mainly on large orders, but, well, like, well, the showcase was one of ten, in ten Yahoo Store sites, what they had, it was one of our sites, so, and we just put there, well, like, well, what we have, well, approximately, for the people.
And we weren't focused on retail, but, well, there was some retail, but purely for Well, there were some thermal imagers, there were some sights, there were some other things.
Well, everything was within the limits of US legislation, because at that time I lived, I think, either in New York or Miami. And every morning we come, and the secretary tells me, Roma, we have 37 orders, 36 of them from Romania, one from Ukraine, one from Belarus. I say, listen, my dear, look what they entered the cards there, take everything off, but don't send anything anywhere, because it was purely stupidly carding, carding, carding.
This was somewhere around 1996-97, what is it?
Pavlovich:
So, carders attacked your legal products, thermal imagers, sights, and so on?
Carder:
Yes, of course, yes.
Pavlovich:
And how did you understand that these were specifically carder orders?
Carder:
Well, I understand, because unlike some of my friends who worked in this direction, Yura calls me from Vancouver and says, Roma, I got an order from Romania for 32 thousand dollars for Motorola, I sent it to them, I say, well, Yura, well, I, well, congratulations, you will get a cupback. He got a cupback, of course, but my carders are just tired.
Well, because there, well, my God, some kind of showcase, well, some of these, well, who needs 27 4th generation thermal imaging cameras in Romania? Well, who needs it? Well, only for sale, for resale. Well, that is, no, they just carded everything in a row, that's where they saw what, and then it was the time when, well, as you understand, this was clothing carding, when you bought these sneakers and all that, well, a card, well, CVV, everything, conditionally.
Pavlovich:
Now, then, you can enter a card in Amazon, right? CVV is not needed on Amazon. That is, the card number, expiration date are enough, that's it, and your purchase from Amazon comes to you without any problems. Even right now? Yes, even right now.
Carder:
And they are not some kind of idiots.
Pavlovich:
Well, six months ago I filmed the last video about this.
Carder:
And they are not some kind of idiots.
Pavlovich:
And Aliexpress, for example, for a small amount, you need CVV, but 3DS is an SMS does not come, if up to 1000 rubles, for example, you buy from Aliexpress without SMS verification.
Carder:
Listen, well, this is some kind of slave of the lamp, i.e. it is to toil, to toil, to toil, i.e. why is it necessary, i.e. here, And so all this happened to me, yes, it was Miami, and then the FBI slapped me, and I ran there and so on, and moved to Dubai.
And in Dubai I had a director, a Kazakh, he is also well-known, then he became in carding circles, and somehow he comes, this is probably 2000, I think, and says, Roma, listen, and here, in my opinion, is a party of all these, well, who carded you in Miami, I say, well, let me see. Well, I was already there, not a carder of mountains, but a carder of planets, I looked, I thought, well, what about this, that is, I wonder.
So, I looked, looked, everything, well, let's say, the gang that carries, well, like this, well, a swan, a crayfish and a pike.
No, guys, that is, there, and someone brags that he took something there from Kazakhstan, and someone from Russia and so on, well, as Vladimir Ilyich said, that if you can't stop the movement, then you need to take it and lead it, so basically I got involved in this, in the sense that, as you remember, you remember, the ideology, I began to introduce the ideology
that, guys, don't touch the Soviet Union, completely.
Pavlovich:
Well, I remember this ideology itself, but of course I don't remember who began to introduce it.
Carder:
Well, I understand, that is, but it still works, but although less and less and less, but, guys, it’s still like, well, you know, it’s hard enough for us against the West, so why bother pushing our own people too?
You better help, you don't care, study somewhere, you remember, study English, study psychology, here's a book for you, here's a book for you, download it, read it, how to work, how to do it, and yes, of course, there's a chance that among the Western cards there will be one of ours who lives there, well, what can we do, well, we'll return it, or something like that, but the principle is that if you can't help but card, you can't help but hack, then at least in the right direction, like Skor did, well, i.e. if you hack, what about Canada, the States, please don't touch your own. No need. We all work in the same vein, we, you understand what the matter is, that the confrontation between the West and conditionally Russia, well, Russia in the broad sense, the Soviet Union, it is much deeper.
And if we don't hold out, then it will be nothing but hamburgers and Coca-Cola, which is in Afghanistan. Democracy came to Afghanistan, the first Coca-Cola plant was built. Come on, guys. And therefore, if anyone is now working in karting and hacking, guys, please don't touch the Soviet Union, the entire Soviet Union, from Kyrgyzstan to anywhere.
And it doesn't matter that now someone bought it, sold out, there's the same Georgia, the same Ukraine, they are all, they are ours, ours, it's all of us.
"Carders, don't touch the Soviet Union"
Pavlovich:
Well, you see, it's not entirely safe, because all sorts of things don't come from there and end up somewhere in the archives, well, they start to protect someone, they take tribute from someone and so on, but when you start to hammer your compatriots, the response comes very quickly.
Carder:
No, that goes without saying, even an idiot would understand that, but look, when we were doing the elephant distribution, that was back in, well, 2001, probably... The first or second year, yes. I warned you, guys, it wouldn't even occur to you to just go and roll up your sleeves on the CR-80 and go to the nearest one and negotiate with the cashier.
You're on your own land, you don't need to do that. You need to support your own, not bully them. That's all.
That's what made me happy, even literally last year, at the beginning of last year, before I retired, one guy, he lives in the States, he's from Kazakhstan, and he's in the know, he says, Roma, well, that's the kind of psychology that's basically supported, well, he says, forty to fifty percent.
Pavlovich:
Well, yeah, they observe that less often now than they did in our time.
Carder:
That is, so what if it does happen? Well, you understand what the matter is, that in reality, if you look at it, the country is having a hard time, and I mean everyone, the entire USSR, and also taking into account all these hang-ups in everyone’s heads, well, in different countries, but if there were no Russia
now, in the form in which it exists, if it weren't for China, well, China is a separate, separate song, then again, we would all simply be rolled into this Coca-Cola and a hamburger, and that's it, well, but what about the States, I know, because I lived there for a long time and a lot, and if you're a sane person, then you simply become a slave to the lamp.
One job, a second, and a third job, you come there, bam, sleep, that's it. Well, if not that. And if you suddenly started doing something, well, the FBI will come and say that you're a Russian agent.
Contents:
- Weren't you afraid of the consequences?
- The effectiveness of special services methods in combating crime
- Who is in US prisons?
- First meeting of carders
- What are transfers and dates like in the USA?
- What do convoys look like in the US?
- The Difference Between Private and Federal Prisons
- Are there "red" prisons in the USA?
- The most positive prison
- Education in American Prisons
- How Boa Got Into Carding
- "Carders, don't touch the Soviet Union"
Weren't you afraid of the consequences?
Pavlovich:
When you entered this field of carding in 2001-2002, by that time you had already encountered all the power and lawlessness, let it be American intelligence services and so on. Weren't you afraid that you would turn the American world against yourself even more and sooner or later you would have to answer for it? Or did you not think about it at all at that moment?
Carder:
The thing is that among my, let's say, clients, customers, including Secret Service, I knew perfectly well how they work. From A to Z. They have their own specific structure. I know a little about the matter, how different intelligence services work. Well, if you take Secret Service, they are so unprofessional that I was simply surprised myself.
That is, there were a number of episodes when, well, grannies from the market, they were, so to speak, more professional than Secret Service. And so, because I had worked with them before, well, I mean, not worked, but... I encountered them.
Yes, they were the clients, I knew their structure, and when they started to torture me, I simply knew which buttons to press. So, it all worked at once, in principle, from, there, some kind of, New York field office to the State Department, because they are very, not just bureaucratic, they are very.
Well, when they took Gonzalez, and suddenly Jake comes running, he is their main specialist on Russia. He says, Roma, listen, this goat, it turns out that not only did he receive 300 thousand a year from us, he also, it turns out, took T.J. Max here and so on. Well, we'll bury him. I say, Zhenya, why are you telling me this, who I am, so to speak, a complete outsider?
Well, I need to share it with someone.
Background:
Albert Gonzalez is an American carder and cybercriminal who was accused of carding and reselling over 170 million bank card numbers between 2005 and 2007. Gonzalez received 20 years.
Pavlovich:
Well, nevertheless, you see, with their, as you say, unprofessionalism, they were able to put you away for 18 years, and me, and Gonzalez, and Psycho for 27, and a bunch of other guys. The latest one was that guy Dirayo, then Levashov Severa, who was on the planet, that spammer, that is, in principle, they managed to reach a lot of cybercriminals.
Carder:
Chancellery. Please. I don’t agree with the word “managed to put away.” It wasn’t Severa who managed to put away, but he, in fact, very much so. Severa worked for about twenty or thirty years, right?
Reference:
Petr Levov (Severa) was sentenced to 33 months in prison in the United States. The prosecution asked for at least 12 years, but the judge sentenced him to 33 months, finding that the estimates of the damage he had caused were exaggerated. The "King of Spam" was arrested in Spain in 2007.
Pavlovich:
But, in general, they managed to punish all those whom we knew as active criminals. That is, effectively-ineffectively, but, nevertheless, they achieved their goals and punished many demonstratively severely.
Carder:
You call me a criminal who fights for peace throughout the world?
The effectiveness of the methods of special services in combating crimes
Pavlovich:
Well, okay, but you still did your commercial cases against affecting interests in the United States and other countries. As did I and many others, you know, from those whom we know. And they punished demonstratively, cruelly, like the same psycho 27 years old and so on. That is why the States do it all the time. You know, I read in my documents and other documents from the Ministry of Justice, when they boast in their press releases that we managed to pull off such an operation.
And they say that we, in cooperation with our colleagues from that department, from that Interpol, Europol, and other international intelligence agencies, managed to punish such-and-such people, and thus we show that you do not steal from us, otherwise the punishment will be sooner or later, and it will be quite severe.
Carder:
And the question?
Pavlovich:
The question is that they still work, as it were, quite effectively, you understand? That is, not always legally, sometimes lawlessly and so on, but retribution will be shot. Retribution is meted out to those who affect the interests of the United States. I wrote an article that you are stealing somewhere and so on, but okay, there is Europe and so on, Asia, but it is quite dangerous for the United States to really encroach on their interests, to play on their field.
Carder:
It is dangerous.
Pavlovich:
In any sphere. In yours it is military, in ours it is common cybercrime.
Carder:
It is dangerous. It is dangerous. Well, I don't think they'll last long, because there's universal hatred there. In the States? Absolutely. That is, both in prison and outside, I lived there and lived there.
Everyone hates everyone, that is, whites hate blacks, they hate them, and there are only 18% of them there.
Pavlovich:
Whites?
Who are sitting in US prisons.
Carder:
No, not robbers, thank God. Already more, almost half. Latinos, well, Latinos are everyone from Latin America, there are Mexicans, and Salvadorans of all kinds, and so on. They are waiting, and the Indians, they are just waiting for it all to end. Well, those who haven't drunk themselves to death yet. I was accepted into the Sioux-Lacoda tribe, and they say, Roma, we'll wait, it will all pass, just like that, calmly.
But hatred within the states, interracial, it's not just seething, it's just something so wild, I'm surprised they're still alive. You see, that's what.
And in this regard, I think we don't need to worry about the States, they'll fall apart on their own, quietly.
Pavlovich:
The first meeting of carders in Odessa, which was somewhere in 2001 or 2004, and the last one, but there were also more local ones, we met there in our circle more than once and often in different countries, we visited each other on vacation, someone from the company paid for all this, so we come to your country, you invite us, you pay there as a rule.
The first meeting of carders
Carder:
No, Seryozha, but the first and only conference of carders, official, when this dance, what is it called, I forgot what it's called, well in Odessa there is some big dance, we are sitting here smoking weed and then they say, and this song sounds again for carders and for all of Odessa.
Pavlovich:
How many people were there, plus or minus?
Carder:
Well, somewhere around 30, that is, well, there were ours, Canada, the Baltics, Ukraine, Russia, of course, but some, whom, you already know, were personally told, under no circumstances should you come, so that you don’t get exposed. Well, basically, people finally saw each other. There were guys from Belarus, two people.
Well, we made a lot of noise there throughout Odessa.
Pavlovich:
Yes, they still remember. In the States, there is a website, this bureau in recognition, yes, bob.Gov, I watched you too when, well, I was already released, you were still sitting around...
Carder:
Listen, what a great phrase, I was already released, and you were still sitting.
What do transfers and dates look like in the USA
Pavlovich:
Yes, I was waiting for the time when I could finally meet you in person and talk like this. And I watch Drinkman through the same website, grief and so on. And there are some cool moments there, well, first of all, you can find any inmate, that is, a prisoner, see when he is getting out plus or minus, again, all sorts of paroles are taken into account there, and your number and everything else.
And there is an item, for example, call or email, for example, call or send an email, then send, I see, a package, send money, a visit, that is, sign up for a date, then some kind of voice concern, that is, it can be some kind of voice message, how it all looks in US prisons in general, that is, it is some kind of convenient human process, not like ours, these lines for a date with packages and everything else.
Carder:
Seryozha, well, first of all, in order for you to get on a date, you need to be approved by the prison, that's why there is a whole process, that is, the inmate, well, I mean the prisoner must fill out an application and it must be approved. You will be questioned if you are not from the States, that is, you do not have these social security and all that stuff, then it is easier, that’s it, but on the other hand, in each
in prison it is different, that is, for example, the BBC guys tried to get through to me, they just took them, well, and said no, for the security of prison and the expense. Well, well, they don’t like the press. Well, but to send a parcel, well, please, send it, but it won’t work.
Why? They are simply prohibited, in principle, all parcels.
Pavlovich:
Well, and some books, for example, there?
Carder:
Well, and books, yes, and only Only from Amazon, because we are smart, and we know that they wrote Russian Books Worldwide, and here it came, and suddenly there are drugs in the spine, or something else, or some message is pierced there, but this is not everywhere, because in prisons, well, chaos, but the chaos in different prisons is different, office.
In a private book on Pavel, they did not receive from Amazon.
Pavel Ivlev, there is a famous writer, and he signed books and sent them to us in prison, and how did we receive them?
Carder:
I don’t know, they received them without me, I left at that time. In some prisons they allow it to be printed on the envelope, well, on a printer, but not signed by hand, just some printing house of Vasya Pupkin, so if it is readable to them in English, that it is a printing house or a printing house that distributes, yes, some kind of publishing house, then sometimes they let it go.
In federal, well, this is about private, in federal prisons, in my opinion, only Amazon and that’s it. Amazon, yes.
Pavlovich:
And e-mail, for example, is it just brought to you as a letter, right? Is this an alternative to letters?
Carder:
No. There is a system called CoreLinks, and from inside the prison it is called TrueLinks. You can take and sign up, and you will be able to communicate with the person there, he will pay, right? We kind of paid, right? Well, you pay from your account, that is, you... Oh, from your prison account, and again, in federal
Pavlovich:
Firms, there's something like 5 cents a minute, whether you read or write, it makes no difference.
Carder:
Yeah, and you still pay, but it's like e-mail, but inside this Corlinks account.
Carder:
A system for transmitting simple messages, but it has nothing to do with e-mails, a prison one.
Carder:
A social network. A lot of people have fallen over on this Corlinks, because it's all inside their server and they have the right to use it for us in court and that's it. All prosecutors automatically remove all your correspondence.
Pavlovich:
They read. Well, like censorship in prison.
Carder:
They don't read, they just film everything, in case there's something else. I'll give you my two cents about this site, Sergey, your screenshot is open in Biopic, of course there are all these links, send a parcel, write a message, and so on. They all just lead to instructions, they're not something ready-made where you can poke and send a message or a parcel. No, just to instructions, and each specific prison can have its own. Different, yes.
What do convoys look like in the US
Pavlovich:
You've been to 18 different prisons, plus or minus, you might not have counted some transit ones, but you counted at least 18 American ones. We're not counting Nikosiva, Cyprus, where you were detained, Egypt, then whatever, Libya, and between all of them, you've been brought to prison a hundred thousand times. What does convoying look like in the United States? We all know this service, the US Marshals, it's called, it's basically a regular convoy, when in the Soviet Union there were conscripts, contract soldiers.
What does it look like in the US?
Carder:
In the US it looks much tougher than in many places. There, it turns out, there are handcuffs and shackles, i.e. shackles, between them there is a chain, this chain is fastened to the belt, around which there is also the same chain, there is a separate lock dangling.
Pavlovich:
It is a heavy construction, right?
Carder:
It is not heavy in weight, it is extremely inconvenient, because your hands are constantly cut by the handcuffs. You can still scratch your nose, scratch the top of your head is basically impossible, but you can't reach it when your hands are on your belt and on the top of your head, so you have to scratch it on whatever comes to hand. When some kind of transportation takes an hour or two to and from court. God bless him. And when transport is by bus, you travel the whole day.
Pavlovich:
And the plane?
Carder:
Same. On the plane there are also flights, inspections and so on. For the most unlucky, and at first I thought that this was only for the most violent or dangerous, but then it turned out that no, they are somehow random.
Carder:
I ended up in Black Box four times.
Carder:
Black Box is when the handcuffs also snap into a box, after which they become a completely rigid structure.
Carder:
That is, like this, you have handcuffs here, and then there is this little box that you… Which locks the chain… You can only move it.
Carder:
With your fingers and that’s all. And due to the fact that our hands are not parallel, but still grow from the keys, and sort of converge at one point, it constantly crashes, it gets absolutely numb.
Carder:
I flew for six hours once… It’s hard, I tried.
Carder:
I wasn’t particularly dangerous, but they put me on, and my term was not that long.
Carder:
They decide for themselves who is especially dangerous and who is not.
Carder:
In the face, right? They'll hit you in the face.
The difference between private and federal prisons
Pavlovich:
Private prisons and these state ones, yes, federal ones. What are the main differences, in your opinion, and which ones are better?
Carder:
The differences are that in private ones it is easier to come to an agreement with the guards. Agree on what? Well, to bring something. Well, not in federal ones, but in federal ones it is somehow more structured. That is, in federal prisons, well, there are idiots, of course, among the guards, but fewer psychopaths.
In private prisons, I have this, well, over the years, the opinion has formed that psychopaths go to prisons, to private ones, who need something for themselves, to take something, well, they have been milking cows all the time, and suddenly a prison opened for them.
Power appeared.
Pavlovich:
Roman is talking about the guards, not about those who are sitting, but about the workers.
Carder:
Yes, of course, I am talking about them. Well, it's impossible to say which is better, private or federal, because each prison is different, and it doesn't depend on the conditions, but on who the guard is. Specifically, on the personality? Yes, that is, there is someone there, screw him, let's just say the conditions are bad.
If the guards are, let's say, nuts, then, well, it happens. There are a lot of psychopaths. Sadists or just the city's crazy people? They are psychopaths, they are just psychopaths. They came to prison to take and torture.
It is especially difficult in the punishment cell, when psychopaths are found among the guards.
Carder:
I will add one more fundamental difference between federal and private prisons. Private prisons are designed to be self-financing. And, accordingly, everything is more expensive. It is more expensive to live there. In a federal prison, everything seems to be cheaper due to the fact that there the funding comes largely from the budget.
Pavlovich:
Yes. But there are no concessions in terms of the regime, that in a private one you are like in a sanatorium, right?
Carder:
Seryozha, all prisons, each one, whether private or federal, they are all different. Well, well, they are simply different. So you come, like you were born into a new world, oops, and you have to see what is happening, what is it.
Well, but even if the prison is private or federal in the same system, then they, well, they are still different.
Pavlovich:
There were all sorts, you go to Ter-Akhat, and you don’t care that it’s federal.
Carder:
Yes, by the way, and who the hell knows what happens there, you understand? Well, that is, and this, by the way, for the soul, it is a rich experience, that is, you enter each new prison, as if you are entering a new life. And it’s all there, there, there. You entered, you were born. That’s it. And forward.
There are some, and so on.
Are there “red” prisons in the USA?
Pavlovich:
And off we go. And there are some like that, for example, a prison, like the one I was in, well, by Belarusian standards, it's a good, black zone, where the cops don't interfere in your life at all. Don't give them any problems. You can do whatever you want there. The main thing is don't fight too much, play football, go to church, go to the cafeteria, you don't have to go, eat yourself, we kind of fight, but when you get caught, we don't really press you there, right? And just where the administration doesn't fool you, doesn't make you a trained dog, we build a cafeteria and so on, and you just live a normal life, you have everything, but you're just deprived of freedom.
Are there such prisons in the States? Have you ever come across any in yours?
Carder:
Well, it's private, by the way, in York, well, before I was sent last year... And York is not private,
Carder:
York is state.
Carder:
State, right?
Carder:
It's state. That is, yes, all the locals sit there, who broke whose nose, listen, there are so many idiots there. Well, just in general... There are, yes, that is, yes, I remember, that is, well, two or three like you say, well, I had them.
Yeah, that's exactly it, that, guys, you somehow realize yourselves so that you don't cause us problems, but that's purely private, yes.
Pavlovich:
But not federal.
Carder:
Although, again, in a private one you should not give a damn at all. But in the federal one I managed to negotiate not to work, and in the private one I had to go to work in the library. I'm not even talking about the obligatory cafeteria, okay, in the library, we sit and read books. And Roma scrubbed the pan in the kitchen after the chicken.
The first month there was obligatory.
Carder:
Listen, I worked there for six months, yes, it turns out, that is, I worked as an assistant, well, of course, as a manager. Scrubbed for six weeks.
Pavlovich:
Disgusting, huh.
Carder:
Huh? Six weeks. A month of mandatory work, and then until they transfer you, until you find a new job. And this is precisely in a private one, that is, in a private one you couldn’t shirk work, but in a federal one – please.
Pavlovich:
So there’s 100% employment, everyone is obliged to do something, or what?
Carder:
No, in private ones, you enter the zone, you are obliged to work.
Carder:
In the kitchen. Again, it has to do with the fact that it’s self-financing, all the living flesh entering the prison works at the rates of pay there, what is it, 5 dollars a month.
Pavlovich:
Per month?
Carder:
Per month.
Pavlovich:
So, not only with us.
Carder:
Six dollars a month.
Pavlovich:
Well, that’s what you get in hand net after all the deductions, right? Yes.
Carder:
Two soaps and one pipe paste.
Pavlovich:
And they don’t provide any of that, any of that.
Carder:
A set? Of course not.
Carder:
No, they do provide these little soaps. At the entrance? Yes. And in the federal prison, you can come at any time, take some toothpaste and soap.
Carder:
Well, yes, the system is different.
Pavlovich:
And which of all the prisons do you remember, what’s the first thing you remember in a negative light and why?
Carder:
Can I remember something positive?
Pavlovich:
Let’s remember something positive. We’ve already mentioned York.
The most positive prison.
Carder:
Williamsburg, South Carolina, 1,200 inmates. Is that a lot? Average. Usually 2,000-something.
Out of 1200, 200 prisoners, a thousand not blacks, and not that kind of blacks, but 10 and, damn, heavyweights, that is, John, what are you talking about, I killed 7 people here, well, I repented, and so I hope that in 17 years I will get out, well, something like that, and you... And I, you know, I got a shot here, and some kind of scam came up with an unfortunate outcome, and I accidentally robbed a bank here.
I say, well, how much did they give you? Well, 27. Well, fine. And how long did you serve? Well, 12. Well, I say, well, you'll get out soon, so what. That's it. And they threw me into this zone so that I wouldn't organize anyone, because they decided that I wouldn't be able to just go and organize blacks.
1200 were in the zone, and of them 1000 of these blacks, who, well, the scum of the earth, from a chervonets and up, killed, stabbed, robbed, that's it.
Then there were a lot of lifers, lifers are, well, those who live in life.
Pavlovich:
Lifetime, yes.
Carder:
Yes, that's it. And, and then there were a little, well, maybe sixty white people, all drug addicts, and they all had eagles here, gouged out here, like this.
Pavlovich:
Was this some kind of gang of theirs?
Carder:
That's how it's done, you know, in South Carolina, in Georgia, well, and nearby. In North Carolina. Then there were about 60 people, also Latinos, who had American citizenship.
Well, I'm the only foreigner, but it was the best for me there, because I don't have to answer for anyone, that is, none of these Georgians, Armenians, Azerbaijanis, who always have some kind of these...
Pavlovich:
Rams.
Carder:
Yeah, they come up with something. Three guys only have to get together, and they always have some kind of squabbles. And everyone takes part in it, the whole zone. And everyone comes to me and says, Roma, here are yours And the Russians again, I say, listen, so what, did you take drugs and not pay, or something else, or something else. And I felt so good in Williamsburg, that is, I spent a year there, graduated from technical school.
Pavlovich:
What specialty technical school?
Education in American prisons
Carder:
Building those funny wooden houses of theirs. Frame houses of that type. Yeah, I also had a second specialty, like carpenter or something like that. Also correspondence? Well, of course, no, well, we studied there in person, they have their own, well, that is, the gist of it is that how many people sign up for a class for each, they are paid 2800 a year in prison, we are paid somewhere around 16 dollars a month, so, we have to study.
I came to class and said, I want to master the gases of all this. And they say, listen, doesn't it bother you that besides you there will be 24 other people in the class, and 23 of them are not black, and at that, such specific ones.
I say, what do I care, I mean, I came to study. Well, I finished my technique, I even have a certificate and so on. But it was good in Williamsburg, because I learned to play the drums there, it turns out that you have to play the drums from notes.
For me it was a revelation, well, a complete one. Then I taught a Japanese language class there, and here’s another thing, that they get paid, in prison they pay if someone teaches a class of some kind of prisoners, 17 thousand dollars, and they paid me 26.
Pavlovich:
Per month?
Carder:
I don’t remember, well, I think so. Well, but I had four lessons a month, and one of my students was the great-grandson of Emperor Hirohita, a Japanese one. I say, listen, you’re kind of, well, kind of Japanese, he says, “Oh, listen, I have this story there, and all that, I say, well, I know 600 spoken hieroglyphs, well, approximately.”
So, he says, “Roma, please teach me.” I say, do you understand what you’re talking about? So you're talking about the right-wing herohita, and I'm here... Russian. Some Russian from somewhere, well, a fly-by-night. Well, teach me. And then I took him to play the drums. That zone was also interesting because there were a lot of Child Molesters there.
These are songs in Russian. Child molesters. But compared to the Lompoc zone, it's in California, Santa Barbara County, that's the Santa Barbara where... The series. Yeah.
Well, that means we had 2,400 people there, 1,800 of which were them.
Pavlovich:
Child molesters?
Carder:
Yeah. And everyone somehow justified themselves there, they went in groups. And then they started removing us from there, that was somewhere around 2009.
How Boa got into carding
Pavlovich:
When I first found out about you, I was probably 18 years old, I was already on Carder.org, the very first forum. All Western journalists, especially ours, they all insist that the first such carding forum was CarderPlanet. Of course. But before that there was Carder.org and many of the top guys, the same Flint, Auditor, for example, all of them, I don’t remember the rest of the names, they all came from Carder.org, Black Monk and so on.
And then a planet emerges, you appear on the planet, and we consider you to be, you know, one of the Dons of the planet, one of the creators, probably, the father of carding, there is also the age difference, we are just 18, 17, 16 and 13 year old snot-nosed kids there, and you already occupy a high position in this hierarchy, you advance serious topics, it was very interesting to read your texts, because they were always humorous, interspersed with some, you know, other examples from literary works, Elfa Petrov flashed there, something deeper. And we, of course, looked at you with admiration then. But specifically about what you do, here are the cards, I was once in Odessa at Leviathan, and for the first time I saw counterfeit plastic.
Of course, we were already up to something there, running some eBay scams, auctions, drinking stuff carding from credit cards, but then I saw some fake cards, and Lyubyafan told me that these were cards from Boa, and basically I then compared your activities on the forum and these cards, and how did you even get into carding from all this activity connected with the special services, from this job in particular, and when?
Carder:
Well, it's all simple. I had a number of companies, and they really got on my nerves, that is, and, well, let's say this way, although we worked mainly on large orders, but, well, like, well, the showcase was one of ten, in ten Yahoo Store sites, what they had, it was one of our sites, so, and we just put there, well, like, well, what we have, well, approximately, for the people.
And we weren't focused on retail, but, well, there was some retail, but purely for Well, there were some thermal imagers, there were some sights, there were some other things.
Well, everything was within the limits of US legislation, because at that time I lived, I think, either in New York or Miami. And every morning we come, and the secretary tells me, Roma, we have 37 orders, 36 of them from Romania, one from Ukraine, one from Belarus. I say, listen, my dear, look what they entered the cards there, take everything off, but don't send anything anywhere, because it was purely stupidly carding, carding, carding.
This was somewhere around 1996-97, what is it?
Pavlovich:
So, carders attacked your legal products, thermal imagers, sights, and so on?
Carder:
Yes, of course, yes.
Pavlovich:
And how did you understand that these were specifically carder orders?
Carder:
Well, I understand, because unlike some of my friends who worked in this direction, Yura calls me from Vancouver and says, Roma, I got an order from Romania for 32 thousand dollars for Motorola, I sent it to them, I say, well, Yura, well, I, well, congratulations, you will get a cupback. He got a cupback, of course, but my carders are just tired.
Well, because there, well, my God, some kind of showcase, well, some of these, well, who needs 27 4th generation thermal imaging cameras in Romania? Well, who needs it? Well, only for sale, for resale. Well, that is, no, they just carded everything in a row, that's where they saw what, and then it was the time when, well, as you understand, this was clothing carding, when you bought these sneakers and all that, well, a card, well, CVV, everything, conditionally.
Pavlovich:
Now, then, you can enter a card in Amazon, right? CVV is not needed on Amazon. That is, the card number, expiration date are enough, that's it, and your purchase from Amazon comes to you without any problems. Even right now? Yes, even right now.
Carder:
And they are not some kind of idiots.
Pavlovich:
Well, six months ago I filmed the last video about this.
Carder:
And they are not some kind of idiots.
Pavlovich:
And Aliexpress, for example, for a small amount, you need CVV, but 3DS is an SMS does not come, if up to 1000 rubles, for example, you buy from Aliexpress without SMS verification.
Carder:
Listen, well, this is some kind of slave of the lamp, i.e. it is to toil, to toil, to toil, i.e. why is it necessary, i.e. here, And so all this happened to me, yes, it was Miami, and then the FBI slapped me, and I ran there and so on, and moved to Dubai.
And in Dubai I had a director, a Kazakh, he is also well-known, then he became in carding circles, and somehow he comes, this is probably 2000, I think, and says, Roma, listen, and here, in my opinion, is a party of all these, well, who carded you in Miami, I say, well, let me see. Well, I was already there, not a carder of mountains, but a carder of planets, I looked, I thought, well, what about this, that is, I wonder.
So, I looked, looked, everything, well, let's say, the gang that carries, well, like this, well, a swan, a crayfish and a pike.
No, guys, that is, there, and someone brags that he took something there from Kazakhstan, and someone from Russia and so on, well, as Vladimir Ilyich said, that if you can't stop the movement, then you need to take it and lead it, so basically I got involved in this, in the sense that, as you remember, you remember, the ideology, I began to introduce the ideology
that, guys, don't touch the Soviet Union, completely.
Pavlovich:
Well, I remember this ideology itself, but of course I don't remember who began to introduce it.
Carder:
Well, I understand, that is, but it still works, but although less and less and less, but, guys, it’s still like, well, you know, it’s hard enough for us against the West, so why bother pushing our own people too?
You better help, you don't care, study somewhere, you remember, study English, study psychology, here's a book for you, here's a book for you, download it, read it, how to work, how to do it, and yes, of course, there's a chance that among the Western cards there will be one of ours who lives there, well, what can we do, well, we'll return it, or something like that, but the principle is that if you can't help but card, you can't help but hack, then at least in the right direction, like Skor did, well, i.e. if you hack, what about Canada, the States, please don't touch your own. No need. We all work in the same vein, we, you understand what the matter is, that the confrontation between the West and conditionally Russia, well, Russia in the broad sense, the Soviet Union, it is much deeper.
And if we don't hold out, then it will be nothing but hamburgers and Coca-Cola, which is in Afghanistan. Democracy came to Afghanistan, the first Coca-Cola plant was built. Come on, guys. And therefore, if anyone is now working in karting and hacking, guys, please don't touch the Soviet Union, the entire Soviet Union, from Kyrgyzstan to anywhere.
And it doesn't matter that now someone bought it, sold out, there's the same Georgia, the same Ukraine, they are all, they are ours, ours, it's all of us.
"Carders, don't touch the Soviet Union"
Pavlovich:
Well, you see, it's not entirely safe, because all sorts of things don't come from there and end up somewhere in the archives, well, they start to protect someone, they take tribute from someone and so on, but when you start to hammer your compatriots, the response comes very quickly.
Carder:
No, that goes without saying, even an idiot would understand that, but look, when we were doing the elephant distribution, that was back in, well, 2001, probably... The first or second year, yes. I warned you, guys, it wouldn't even occur to you to just go and roll up your sleeves on the CR-80 and go to the nearest one and negotiate with the cashier.
You're on your own land, you don't need to do that. You need to support your own, not bully them. That's all.
That's what made me happy, even literally last year, at the beginning of last year, before I retired, one guy, he lives in the States, he's from Kazakhstan, and he's in the know, he says, Roma, well, that's the kind of psychology that's basically supported, well, he says, forty to fifty percent.
Pavlovich:
Well, yeah, they observe that less often now than they did in our time.
Carder:
That is, so what if it does happen? Well, you understand what the matter is, that in reality, if you look at it, the country is having a hard time, and I mean everyone, the entire USSR, and also taking into account all these hang-ups in everyone’s heads, well, in different countries, but if there were no Russia
now, in the form in which it exists, if it weren't for China, well, China is a separate, separate song, then again, we would all simply be rolled into this Coca-Cola and a hamburger, and that's it, well, but what about the States, I know, because I lived there for a long time and a lot, and if you're a sane person, then you simply become a slave to the lamp.
One job, a second, and a third job, you come there, bam, sleep, that's it. Well, if not that. And if you suddenly started doing something, well, the FBI will come and say that you're a Russian agent.
